Pirates of the Caribbean: Community Prequel Script

[Pieter Boelen]

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It is interesting that Jack wasn't really the focal point of the first movie, but I think he kinda became it in the sequels. The first movie opened up with Elizabeth and then Will and Jack of course doesn't make his odd entrance until later so I do agree with Pieter on that assessment.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->According to Ted and Terry he isn't even the main character of the sequels. But I can see why anyone would think he is. After all: The whole thing started because of HIS deal with Davy Jones.

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Your Norrington/Sparrow angle is an interesting one. Norrington however didn't know who Jack was until he looked at his arm and saw the tattoo (of course he had heard of Jack because all he needed to see was that tattoo to state his full name) "Jack Sparrow isn't it?" So its obvious then that they cannot meet at all in any prequel.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->That's what I said, isn't it? Jack greatly influences Norrington's carreer, but neither Jack nor Norrington is aware of it. That adds the irony when Norrington want to kill Jack in PotC 1: He owes Jack a great deal, but doesn't know it. But neither does Jack. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That is an interesting analysis of Jack and his father. I almost get the sense that his father was inserted into the movie at the last minute because someone thought it would be cool to have Keith Richards be his father. It is hard to go the respectable route for Jack early in his career if his father was a pirate, unless he never knew his father growing up like Will Turner never knew his.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I think they did intend to put him in there, but they also wanted to make it a part that could be easily replaced if Keith Richards wouldn't want to do it.

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And I agree with having Jack not seem as daffy earlier in his life. I have always like the idea that Jack's personality, while a bit quirky, was toned down quite a bit when he was younger. I would like to think that when he was marooned by Barbossa that that was when he noticeably became a bit off, like his personality was amplified after that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I would really like to see Jack originally being smart, but a bit gullible, and over the course of the film see him learning that he mustn't be so nice and trusting of people.

I also had the idea of ending the film with Jack finding out about the treasure of Isla de Muerte and the last thing we see in the film is Jack hiring Barbossa to go and collect the treasure. We all know what happens afterwards, so we don't need to show that. The next film should be CotBP. So people watching the films in order will only find out about the whole mutiny thing halway into CotBP. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Evil or just plain ambitious and greedy? After all, you can't call him evil if he wants to eradicate piracy. Many rulers have tried to do that since the days when Greece ruled the Mediterranean Sea. Although he is definitely the antagonist in the film.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Exactly. We must show why Beckett is a bad guy and may not win. Otherwise people might think that Beckett is not such a bad guy. After all, he only wants to rid the world of piracy and make money. Is that such a bad thing? We must show that: yes, that is a bad thing! At least the way Beckett is going about it.

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Jack is suprised to see that the curse is real, but he did know of the curse and probably took it seriously. It is interesting to note that Jack's surprise at the curse being real meant that he has had no contact or even seen Barbossa or the Black Pearle since he was marooned, which leads to the obvious question of what he has been doing since then.
I agree though to tamp down on the supernatural, though it should be taken as a matter of fact since it exists so prominently in their world.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I would like the prequel to start out in a world that is seemingly normal where people are just as surprised of the supernatural as you or I would be. I think the supernatural should be considered myths in that world, just like in our own, but in the case of the PotC world, some of these myths actually turn out to be true. So I don't think the it should be taken as a matter of fact at all. At least not at the beginning of the prequel. Ideally we would only drop some hints in the prequel, but only go all-out on the supernatural in CotBP with the skeletons. Then as the movies progress, the main characters become accustomed to the supernatural and it can be taken matter-of-factly in the last films. But there must have been a time when Jack Sparrow thought the world was normal and there was no supernatural, so that's where I want to start out from.

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Lots of ideas there. You want to believe that deep down Jack is a good guy at heart, though his actions in the second movie contradict that a bit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I personally want Jack to start out as a good man and progressively hide his goodness from the rest of the world, but <i>especially</i> from himself. After he becomes a pirate, he doesn't WANT to be a good man anymore and does his very best not to be. But as seen during the films, Jack will always make the right choice when it's really imporant. For example at the end of DMC when he rows away during the Kraken attack, but returns. Jack rowing away is the Jack who doesn't want to be a good man. Jack returning is the Jack who simply can't help it.

<!--quoteo(post=213936:date=Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 07:00 PM) [snapback]213936[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If Jack makes the deal with Jones then I think we cannot ignore Jones all that much. He does become integral to the story from that moment. Jack probably took Jones seriously, its just that he wants the Wench back and that desire outweighs whatever reservations he has about Jones. This can be open to debate though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I'm not talking about ignoring Davy Jones. I mean not showing him too much in the film, especially not in an overly squid-like form. This so that we still leave that surprise for DMC. Instead I would like to have much of the Davy Jones story told as if it were only a myth in the prequel until Jack actually meets Davy. Nice to add would again be conflicting versions of the myths, so that Jack does not know what to believe and what not. It would also be nice to add some myths that DON'T turn out to be true. After all: If all myths turn out to be true, there will be no myths left. So the backstory of Davy could be told partly be random sailors (Mr. Gibbs?), partly by Tia Dalma and partly by Davy himself when Jack finally meets him.

It seems that a lot of my ideas are based on the notion of NOT showing EVERYTHING in the prequel. If we show a lot of supernatural in the prequel, it is no longer a surprise in CotBP. If we show the mutiny in the prequel, we are no longer left wondering why we meet Jack in CotBP the way we do. If we show Davy Jones and the Flying Dutchman in their DMC form in the prequel, one of the main assets of DMC is lost. If we show Singapore in the prequel, it again is no longer a surprise in AWE. What I'm trying to say is: We should try to come up with a story that does not decrease the effectiveness and surprises of the existing PotC films.

 

[Old Salt]

<!--quoteo(post=213949:date=Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]213949[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I also had the idea of ending the film with Jack finding out about the treasure of Isla de Muerte and the last thing we see in the film is Jack hiring Barbossa to go and collect the treasure. We all know what happens afterwards, so we don't need to show that. The next film should be CotBP. So people watching the films in order will only find out about the whole mutiny thing halway into CotBP. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like that. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="me.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=213949:date=Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]213949[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would like the prequel to start out in a world that is seemingly normal where people are just as surprised of the supernatural as you or I would be. I think the supernatural should be considered myths in that world, just like in our own, but in the case of the PotC world, some of these myths actually turn out to be true. So I don't think the it should be taken as a matter of fact at all. At least not at the beginning of the prequel. Ideally we would only drop some hints in the prequel, but only go all-out on the supernatural in CotBP with the skeletons. Then as the movies progress, the main characters become accustomed to the supernatural and it can be taken matter-of-factly in the last films. But there must have been a time when Jack Sparrow thought the world was normal and there was no supernatural, so that's where I want to start out from.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree with that. Maybe it is not until one becomes a sailor or a pirate and are roaming the seas that they are introduced to a world where some of these myths and legends that they may have heard about as a child turn out to be true.

<!--quoteo(post=213949:date=Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]213949[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Jack rowing away is the Jack who doesn't want to be a good man. Jack returning is the Jack who simply can't help it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like that phrase, for that does sum up Jack Sparrow.

<!--quoteo(post=213949:date=Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]213949[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm not talking about ignoring Davy Jones. I mean not showing him too much in the film, especially not in an overly squid-like form. This so that we still leave that surprise for DMC. Instead I would like to have much of the Davy Jones story told as if it were only a myth in the prequel until Jack actually meets Davy. Nice to add would again be conflicting versions of the myths, so that Jack does not know what to believe and what not. It would also be nice to add some myths that DON'T turn out to be true. After all: If all myths turn out to be true, there will be no myths left. So the backstory of Davy could be told partly be random sailors (Mr. Gibbs?), partly by Tia Dalma and partly by Davy himself when Jack finally meets him.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree that too much of Davy Jones could start to grow old on people. He is best left to small appearances throughout the script and film where people don't get a chance to grow accustomed to him and he remains mysterious and is always a shock when reintroduced.

<!--quoteo(post=213949:date=Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 9 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]213949[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It seems that a lot of my ideas are based on the notion of NOT showing EVERYTHING in the prequel. If we show a lot of supernatural in the prequel, it is no longer a surprise in CotBP. If we show the mutiny in the prequel, we are no longer left wondering why we meet Jack in CotBP the way we do. If we show Davy Jones and the Flying Dutchman in their DMC form in the prequel, one of the main assets of DMC is lost. If we show Singapore in the prequel, it again is no longer a surprise in AWE. What I'm trying to say is: We should try to come up with a story that does not decrease the effectiveness and surprises of the existing PotC films.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, we also have to realize that nothing will be a surprise to the audience because they have seen it already in the first film. I understand your point about not showing everything in the prequel, not all things need to be explained or shown. There are so many loose ends in the three films that it would be easy just to expound on a few of them and leave the rest to the imagination. I have to admit I hadn't thought about the mutiny scene. I would agree that is not imperative to show, as I said some things are best left to the imagination. And I take your point about not having to explain exactly all Jack has been up too during the long years after the mutiny and before he steps onto the dock at Port Royale. We'll have to decide how far up we bring to the prequel to the present at the start of CotBP. As I stated, I like your idea of ending it with Jack hiring Barbossa. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="me.gif" />

 

[Pieter Boelen]

<!--quoteo(post=213961:date=Sep 9 2007, 09:22 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 9 2007, 09:22 PM) [snapback]213961[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well, we also have to realize that nothing will be a surprise to the audience because they have seen it already in the first film.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I'm thinking about people in the future who want to see the films in chronological order.

 

[DAS123]

Old Salt,

I have read your list of ideas, and i think i know what you are getting at. You want a relatively mild movie with small sea battles and sword fights. Here's my point of view. We owe it to the POTC fans to have a HUGE sea battle (in terms of numbers) to make up for the crappy 1-3 ship seabattles throughout the series. I agree much of the story should be about Norrington, but also Jack, we need to portray him as a trusty sea captain, and turn him into a pirate.

Also about Davy Jones, how does Beckett know of his awesome powers? I think that should be explained in here. When Jones raises the Wench, sparrow shaves 3 years off of his captaincy to have Jones defend the Wench as she makes her way out. In doing this Beckett sees how Jones tears apart his armada like toy ships, and that is what gives him is motive to seek the heart of Jones during DMC to stop piracy. Also Jones' backstory should be explained in here, i dont know if i like the idea of Gibbs explaining it. I would use the flashback approach to the crowd has something to relate to rather than just listening to Gibbs explain it. Also for younger viewers it will help them understand. Maybe Jones doesnt start shirking his duties until AFTER Sparrow makes a deal with him, so we can still show him in human form without giving away the surprise in DMC. The Dutchman also is not covered in crustaceans.


"According to Ted and Terry he isn't even the main character of the sequels. But I can see why anyone would think he is. After all: The whole thing started because of HIS deal with Davy Jones."
True, so Jones must be shown in this movie. Do you remember that Sparrow was surprised to see Bootstrap? I think it is partialy because of his sea-like appearance.

Guys, i have met numerous people that say Jack is the one reason they go and see pirates. I personally think he is hilarrious. Also in all 3 POTC movies the supernatural elements are always there. It wouldnt be a surprise to see anything supernatural in the prequels, because it would be odd for one movie to have almost no supernatural elements then the next 3 to be swimming in it. It would be lopsided, and by now pretty much everyone knows atleast some supernatural element from movie previews on TV. Just think about that. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="icon_wink.gif" />

 

[morgan terror]

salty, you're a bit too late if you want to prevent davy from growing too much on people. you'll be surprised at how many people from whatever age group already like him. i agree with salty on the ending of the film.

 

[Old Salt]

Actually, Mercer, I haven't given any ideas yet, I've just been responding to other peoples. I don't want a mild movie at all in terms of sea battles and sword fights. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/duel_pa.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":ixi" border="0" alt="duel_pa.gif" /> I would like to see some major ones in keeping with the script. You bought up Star Wars before in another post and I think that Lucas made a mistake in his prequels in not interjecting enough action. It is no coincidence that the "Revenge of the Sith" was the most popular of the prequels and it was because it was the most action packed. I guess some would argue that people need constant visual stimulation to hold their interest in a movie and suspense films are a thing of the past, but I feel you can have both if its balanced right in the script.

Jack Sparrow is a major draw to the film. He is the most fascinating when it comes down to it. I think Barbossa is almost in that catagoryl and Norrington provided a nice couterbalance to them both in the first film with his law and order personality. But Jack really was the draw and of course he has to figure prominently in any script we come up with.

With Davy Jones, my point is not to have him on screen for long periods at a time if he is going to have his squid face. Have him figure throughout the script but best to keep an air of mystery about him, so when he does show he has an impact. That's just a feeling I have about it and it is debatable. I do want him to figure in it because I do believe he is an important part of the story. Of course, that's just a suggestion and I know others may feel differently.

 

[Old Salt]

<!--quoteo(post=213969:date=Sep 9 2007, 04:20 PM:name=morgan terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(morgan terror @ Sep 9 2007, 04:20 PM) [snapback]213969[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->salty, you're a bit too late if you want to prevent davy from growing too much on people. you'll be surprised at how many people from whatever age group already like him. i agree with salty on the ending of the film.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't want to prevent Jones from growing on people, Morgan, I just thought he lost some of his impact with too much exposure. What I mean by that is I think he is more effective with five minutes of screen time during a scene then when he is on for ten or fifteen minutes straight. Davy Jones should be more of a mystery. To put it another way, remember that movie "Nightmare on Elm Street"? The orginal, not the fifty-five sequels. Well, I remember when the first one came out back in the early 1980s? I remember everyone was going on and on about that movie back then and what made that movie so terrifying was that you only saw Freddie Kruger in the shadows and for brief glimpses when he attacked. It added to the terror and to the mystique of the character. Sometimes less is more.

 

[Commodore John Paul Jones]

The Gibbs explaining Jones wouldn't work.

"That was back before I met him, when he was captain of the <i>Black Pearl</i>."

Remember that line? Sides, Gibbs was a boatswain in the Royal Navy with Norrington. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

I think that if Sparrow and Jones were both captains with Beckett, that would explain how the Lord knows about Jones... he witnessed it. Jones's ship, the <i>Flying Dutchman</i> was sunk along with the <i>Wicked Wench</i>, but Tia Dalma saved her lover's life by bestowing upon him immortality, in exchange for the duties of ferrying the sea's dead. Jack strikes the deal, not really minding the fact that he would be serving with Jones, for they were almost allies. However, while Jones is out at sea for 10 years, Tia Dalma and Jack had a little affair and Jones completely turned on Jack and Tia, explaining Jones' hate towards Sparrow and his determination to make Sparrow pay his debt. This would also explain his hate towards Tia and his deciding to discontinue his ferrying duties, thus making him the horror we see in the last two films.
If Jones and Sparrow were allies, one immortal and one with an un-naturally fast ship, would make any port succumb to them without a fight, eh? We would also get to see Jones in human form, thus giving him his deserved screen time and preserving the shock of the cursed captain in DMC and AWE.

 

[DAS123]

Good point Commodore, just i still think we can put more action into it if we go the way i suggested with having Beckett witness the awesome power of Jones, who destroys half his armada. This would explain why Beckett is sooo interested in finding Jones' heart, i will be the center piece of his crusade to destroy the pirates. I still havent heard any opinions on THIS matter, and i am DYING to hear what everyone thinks about my plan listed above. I think Sparrow and Jones could become one time allies, then Sparrow double-crosses jones and has an affair with miss Dalma. that is a good idea Commodore. Also that thing about immortality and a fast ship, that would explain why Nassau was sacked by Sparrow without firing a shot, he took the credit, and Jones never got recognition, that would give him even more of a reason to hate Sparrow in addition to having an affair with his love. I like this storyline. Again, most of the movie, if not all should have Jones being human. So it IS a shock in DMC to see him like that. I havent written anything more on my script, because of this debating, nothing wrong with it, i just dont want to put a ton of effort into it when suddenly everyone changes their mind about the plot, and i am left high and dry. We have to come to an agreement soon. I think it is good that we are debating, because in the process we are outlining our script.

 

[DAS123]

EVERYONE, PLEASE READ THIS! PLEASE VOTE ON THIS BALLOT SO I CAN SEE WHERE WE ARE ALL STANDING!
YAY, NAY, YES, NO, or ABSTAIN WILL DO FINE! PLEASE ANSWER IN THIS FORMAT:

1. Should Davy Jones be in human form the entire movie?

2. Should Norrington recieve a large part in this movie?

3. Would you have the Dutchman in a sea battle?

4. Would you like Jones and Sparrow to work for Beckett?

5. Would you go for the whole Tia Dalma Affair, and Jones and Sparrow working together idea.

6. Would you rather wait and see what else surfaces.

7. Should the Prequel have the best visual effects out of the whole series?

8. Should there be more than one prequel?

9. Should we tie a lot of ends in the Prequel?

10. Should Jack start off very professional then get more barbaric over the course of the movie(s)?

MORE QUESTIONS AS THEY PRESENT THEMSELVES. THANKS FOR YOUR HARD WORK! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="icon_wink.gif" /> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="me.gif" />

 

[DAS123]

1. Yes

2. Definately

3. Yes

4. No

5. Possibly, more clarification needed.

6. Abstain

7. YES!!

8. Depends

9. Yes

10. I think so.

 

[Old Salt]

1) 1. Should Davy Jones be in human form the entire movie?

<i>Yes. That would add to the shock value and it would make sense later on as to why he changed into the horror he was in the 2nd and 3rd films, because he broke the deal. I like the idea of Sparrow and Jones attacking Nassau except why did the port surrender without firing a shot? Was Jones immortality already known and thus he was feared? Was Sparrow that legendary a captain? And wasn't Jones breaking the deal by attacking a port instead of just ferrying the dead? Would he be able to use his immortality for destructive purposes?</i>

2. Should Norrington recieve a large part in this movie?

<i>Yes.</i>

3. Would you have the Dutchman in a sea battle?

<i>Yes.</i>

4. Would you like Jones and Sparrow to work for Beckett?

<i>Abstain.</i>

5. Would you go for the whole Tia Dalma Affair, and Jones and Sparrow working together idea?

<i>Abstain. We do need to clarify this a bit more.</i>

6. Would you rather wait and see what else surfaces?

<i>Yes. More brainstorming will no doubt produce more ideas that can be fit in.</i>

7. Should the Prequel have the best visual effects out of the whole series?

<i>Yes.</i>

8. Should there be more than one prequel?

<i>Abstain. I guess we won't know the answer to that one till we finish this script.</i>

9. Should we tie a lot of ends in the Prequel?

<i>Abstain. Depends on what should be tied up and what should be left to imagination.</i>

10. Should Jack start off very professional then get more barbaric over the course of the movie(s)?

<i>Abstain. Have we decided how to reconcile the fact that Jack is from pirate stock yet seems to be an honest captain at the beginning of our script? I mean, no doubt it is possible of course, but should we explain it to make it plausible to the audience?</i>

 

[Pieter Boelen]

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->EVERYONE, PLEASE READ THIS! PLEASE VOTE ON THIS BALLOT SO I CAN SEE WHERE WE ARE ALL STANDING!
YAY, NAY, YES, NO, or ABSTAIN WILL DO FINE! PLEASE ANSWER IN THIS FORMAT:<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Excellent idea to pose it as a question list, Mercer! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="me.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1. Should Davy Jones be in human form the entire movie?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I'd say either human form or almost-human form. Or both during the film so the audience sees just a tiny hint of what he'll become. Personally I wouldn't give Davy Jones much <i>screen</i>time at all so that the character remains a mystery, though I do agree with giving him a fair amount of <i>story</i>time. I would personally also not <i>show</i> too much of Davy's story. I prefer to have it told as a myth at first with the myth turning out to be true throughout the film(s). As far as Mr. Gibbs telling the story: That was only a random suggestion because Mr. Gibbs is usually used for telling myths and stories. It could be any other sailor though. Sailors always liked to tell each other these kind of stories.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->2. Should Norrington recieve a large part in this movie?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I would like that as long as he actually does have a part to play. Having Norrington in just for the sake of having Norrington in wouldn't cut it. I would like to see some of Norrington's earlier actions and some of his climbing up the ranks of the Royal Navy. This also with the idea of him being killed in AWE: If we get to know the character better, his death will have much more of an impact. Also his turn to piracy in DMC would be even more shocking. Again I am thinking here of people wanting to see the films in chronological order at some point in the future.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->3. Would you have the Dutchman in a sea battle?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->We already have the Dutchman in several sea battles in the current films, so I wouldn't show too much of the Dutchman fighting. Your idea of Beckett seeing the Dutchman take out a whole convoy of his ships would make sense, but I wouldn't show that battle from up close. Rather show it from a distance while Jack sails away on the Pearl. I would very much like to see a truly big sea battle with multiple ships in a PotC film, but it just doesn't belong in a prequel, because if the best and biggest sea battle is in the first film of the series, all other sea battles will be a disappointment. That is why I would vote for making at least one prequel to CotBP and one sequel to AWE.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->4. Would you like Jones and Sparrow to work for Beckett?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->No, not really. I would prefer Jack and Davy to not have much (anything) to do with each other until they meet for the agreement of raising Jack's ship from the bottom of the sea.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->5. Would you go for the whole Tia Dalma Affair, and Jones and Sparrow working together idea.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->No, not really. As obvious in DMC (and also partly in AWE), there <i>was</i> some previous romantic tension between Jack and Tia, but I wouldn't go as far as making THAT the reason for Tia not returning to Davy. I prefer the reason for Tia not returning to Davy to simply be that she didn't feel like it at that particular day. After all: She <i>is</i> as harsh and unpredictable as the sea. Instead I would just like to see some romantic teasing between Tia and Jack whenever they're together, but not go too deeply into that. I would prefer to see Jack romantically teasing a lot of ladies in the film, including the wenches in Tortuga, Tia Dalma and perhaps the daughter of the governor of Nassau after sacking it. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/whistling.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="whistling.gif" />

BTW: I think we should also have some stories in the script about Calypso and what the world was like when she was free. This would then give some hints of what to expect in a sequel to AWE, which takes place in a world where Calypso has again be released.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->7. Should the Prequel have the best visual effects out of the whole series?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->The special effects should be at least as good as anything in the other films. In other words: They should look convincing. However, I'd prefer to not have much <i>special</i> effects in there at all with skeletons and curses and cetacean characters. Instead I would have the prequel be almost devoid of the supernatural and just be similar to an "ordinary" pirate movie with the supernatural only taking its place in the story in CotBP. Otherwise the CotBP skeleton pirates will lose just about all of their impact, which would be most unfortunate.

I think all of the PotC films should have at least one thing truly special to them that no other film has. Example: CotBP has the skeleton pirates, DMC has the Kraken and AWE has Singapore, the world's end sequence and the whirlpool sea battle. The prequel should not diminish the effectiveness of any of the specialties of the other films. Therefore: No Kraken in the film, no Singapore, world's end or whirlpool in the film. However, if we were to add much supernatural elements into the prequel, the skeletons pirates will not be surprising at all. Instead, if we keep the prequel virtually devoid of the supernatural, the skeleton pirates will have even <i>more</i> impact.

Above would also mean we need to think up something special for the prequel that none of the other films has. I would say the sacking of Nassau would be a prime candidate. However, even the virtual <i>absense</i> of anything obviously supernatural could be considered something unique for that film.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->8. Should there be more than one prequel?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Not nescessarily. If we can fit everything comfortably into one film, I would prefer that to having more than one prequel. Like stated above: I would prefer to have one prequel and one sequel.

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->9. Should we tie a lot of ends in the Prequel?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->We should tie up several loose ends, but we should resist the temptation to tie up too many of them. I would suggest this as a list of the minimum amount of things to explain:
- The burning and sinking of the Wicked Wench
- Jack's deal with Davy Jones
- How and why Jack turned into a pirate
- What mark <i>did</i> Jack leave on Beckett?
- Why is Beckett a bad guy and why shouldn't he be allowed to win in the end?
- Some hints on Davy Jones' and Tia Dalma's backstory
- Some hints on what the world was like with Calypso at large (but NO hints that Tia is Calypso!!!)
- Jack's sacking of Nassau without firing a single shot

<!--quoteo(post=213988:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM:name=Mercer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mercer @ Sep 10 2007, 04:34 AM) [snapback]213988[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->10. Should Jack start off very professional then get more barbaric over the course of the movie(s)?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Yes, Jack should start out as an honest, respectable man. This would allow us to see an interesting different side of Jack and see his transformation to being a pirate. Also several of the reviews of the PotC sequels say that Jack's performance is losing some of its effectiveness because it is shown so much. By showing Jack's transformation, this would allow us to show something decidedly different. Also I want Jack to always be a good person at heart and never do anything that can be considered as nasty and evil. After all: Jack might become a pirate, but he IS a HERO. I wouldn't describe Jack as being "barbaric" though. Instead I would describe pirate Jack as being clever, but untrustworthy and quite selfish. However, when it is really import, you will always see that Jack's good side will come up again. That is what I personally like about Jack: He seems utterly untrustworthy, but in the end he <i>is</i> a good man, even though he really, really doesn't want to be.

As for explaining Jack being respectable while having a pirate father: I personally wouldn't explain that at all. The audience can make up their own minds on that. Was Jack only pretending to be a respectable captain? Or did Jack hate pirates just as much as Will or Norrington at first? Or perhaps Jack simply became respectable BECAUSE his father was a pirate? After all: Sometimes sons will deliberately try to be the opposite of what their fathers are. We could drop several hints in the films that would support all of the options, but never give an absolute answer. Instead the options and hints should be conflicting. This will result in Jack remaining a mystery, even though we do show some of his earlier life.

 

[Old Salt]

<!--quoteo(post=213993:date=Sep 10 2007, 05:03 AM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Sep 10 2007, 05:03 AM) [snapback]213993[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As for explaining Jack being respectable while having a pirate father: I personally wouldn't explain that at all. The audience can make up their own minds on that. Was Jack only pretending to be a respectable captain? Or did Jack hate pirates just as much as Will or Norrington at first? Or perhaps Jack simply became respectable BECAUSE his father was a pirate? After all: Sometimes sons will deliberately try to be the opposite of what their fathers are. We could drop several hints in the films that would support all of the options, but never give an absolute answer. Instead the options and hints should be conflicting. This will result in Jack remaining a mystery, even though we do show some of his earlier life.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think we may have to drop some hints here about it. I like leaving some things a mystery as well but others do need to be explained. And to have Jack start off as an honest, trustworthy and respectable captain just doesn't seem realistic without at least some explanation as to how and why he started that way. Also, by Jack's very nature it is unrealistic that he would start out like that, since he fell so easily into being the Captain Jack Sparrow we met in the later films. Why would he digress so easily into that type of character if he were respectable? It would seem that his honest sea captain persona rested on a foundation of selfishness and deceit.
I do agree, and stated earlier, that some children will go in a totally opposite direction from their parents just to carve out their own identity in life. And that could very well have been what happened to Jack. I just think that we have to make the audience aware of it.

 

[morgan terror]

maybe Jack became a pirate for economic or financial reasons? maybe something to consider. what i personally find the most intersting idea was that he was forced to become one, largely or partially due to the branding.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I personally like to think that deep down, Jack isn't as selfish and deceitful as he seems to be. That that is just a role he plays, trying to fool both the world and himself. That deep down, he truly is a good man and that that was how he started out. Then you see where that gets him. Because he is a good man, he is forced into piracy and must learn to act like a pirate in order to survive. Until eventually the act (almost) becomes his real personality and his real personality of being a good man is hidden so far that he himself isn't even aware of it anymore. Until he is forced to make a choice between the good and the easy. Because as we have seen in the films: Jack does make the right choice in the right moments. That is why he remains a sympathetic character. If he were just selfish and deceitful with no conscience, as hidden though it might be, he would just be a nasty character, which obviously he is not.

<!--quoteo(post=214001:date=Sep 10 2007, 04:21 PM:name=Old Salt)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Old Salt @ Sep 10 2007, 04:21 PM) [snapback]214001[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think we may have to drop some hints here about it. I like leaving some things a mystery as well but others do need to be explained. And to have Jack start off as an honest, trustworthy and respectable captain just doesn't seem realistic without at least some explanation as to how and why he started that way.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->I agree. That's why I suggested dropping several different hints for several different explanations. That way we even give multiple reasons, but still keep it a mystery.

I really like the "sea turtles" strategy of giving more than one explanation to certain questions. The explanation of how Jack got off the island is an example. And I especially like Jack's father giving "sea turtles" as explanation to the dog being at Shipwreck Island while last we saw the dog, he was at Pelegostos. I think that's just hilarious because it is obvious that the writers KNOW it is weird, possibly impossible even, and they deliberately give a nonsense explanation! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/w00t.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="w00t.gif" />

 

[Commodore John Paul Jones]

<b>1. Should Davy Jones be in human form the entire movie?</b>
Aye. I would like to give him less screentime, but the story would be hard to create because he plays such a big part. So I say completely human, no hints of damnation, and average screentime, like the amount Pintel and Ragetti recieve.

<b>2. Should Norrington recieve a large part in this movie?</b>
Nay. Norrington was a lieutenant when Elizabeth saw the <u>cursed</u> <i>Black Pearl</i>. So Norrington would only be a midshipman or not even in the Royal Navy yet. If my books are published and successful, it would fill in the eight years between the dream and his appointment to Commodore. (Which could open up for a possible TV miniseries like Hornblower!)

<b>3. Would you have the Dutchman in a sea battle?</b>
AYE. Sea battles = good movie. Part of the reason I din't like DMC as much and loved AWE was the amount of naval warfare shown in them... after all, the very theme "pirates" means ships and battles. If there wen't many, then why don't we just go ahead and make this a movie about highwaymen? Now large scale battles might not be the best idea in a prequel, as to make the climax in AWE seem even bigger. But plenty of ship to ship battles would be nice.

<b>4. Would you like Jones and Sparrow to work for Beckett?</b>
Nay. Upon further thought and discussion, I changed my mind.

<b>5. Would you go for the whole Tia Dalma Affair, and Jones and Sparrow working together idea.</b>
Nay. I like the idea of keeping it playful and Tia Dalma less of a cheater. Perhaps Davy could <i>over react</i> to Jack's harmless flirting, making the situation more ironic.

<b>6. Would you rather wait and see what else surfaces.</b>
Of course. Keep the ideas comming!

<b>7. Should the Prequel have the best visual effects out of the whole series?</b>
Aye. Visual effects only progress... I think what was meant though, was should the insane scenes get bigger. No. The fight on the yardarm and the whirlpool was cool, but that adds to the intensity of AWE. Keep the prequel simple like TCotBP. But feel free to go further with cool camera angles and shots. So go for the cool looking sweep shot of a sea battle, but don't let it get like The Matrix.

<b>8. Should there be more than one prequel?</b>
I think two prequels and one sequel would be good. This allows us to spread out the content of the prequel storyline and elaborate and go bigger after AWE to satisfy those that want a big sea battle and tied up ends left open.

<b>9. Should we tie a lot of ends in the Prequel?</b>
Aye, but only a few or ones that people already predict. The ones that require more imagination should be left at just that: imagination.

<b>10. Should Jack start off very professional then get more barbaric over the course of the movie(s)?</b>
Aye, but he should go pirate, not barbaric. He needs to realize that to be a pirate, he must sometimes comit the necessary evil. However, it becomes apparent over the course of the movie that perhaps brains over braun works better for him, hence his facade of the "slightly loony and drunk"... so his enemies underestimate him and allow him to manipulate them.


I read something about Jack gaining a reputation prior to his sacking of Nassau. His father is already a pirate... wouldn't you fear the son of the worst of all pirates? (To a degree.) And the sight of a black ship under black sails accompanied by a ship that seemed to rise from the depths would do more than enough to make a port shake in its boots. Davy doesn't need to fire a shot if they see what his ship can do, therefore not breaking his code.
I also think that there should be a period after raising the <i>Wench</i> and before Davy over reacts and turns on Jack and Tia... allowing a friendship between the two, which makes Jones' bitterness later even more extreme and shocking. (To imagine that once these two achieved the most feared alliance in the Caribbean!)

 

[DAS123]

Okay, i see what most people want, again I WANT TO SEE THE DUTCHMAN IN A BIG BATTLE. Now that does not mean some HUGE whirlpool opens up and crap, just a big sea battle in terms of NUMBERS, something we have been without. (AWE EIC fleet 300+ doesnt count, because when beckett died it was like "okay, jigs up, 298 of us and 9 of them, oop, looks like they'll win.)

<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hi.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":gday" border="0" alt="hi.gif" /> I havent heard much commenting on my idea of having Jones defend the Wench as it is raised, thus forming a friendship between the two which could tie into what you were saying Commodore. Now it is not a "convoy" in a sense of merchants, it is a full fledged ARMADA. Beckett witnesses Jones destroying his ships with ease, which gets Beckett onto the idea of using Jones to rule the seas.

Okay, everyone likes the idea of Jones in human form, great! I am happy. I agree that he should get some screentime similar to Pintel and Raghetti, aye, i'll settle for that.

Guys, by visual effects i mean battles, not skeletons and sea creatures.

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK GUYS! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="me.gif" />

 

[DAS123]

"Davy doesn't need to fire a shot if they see what his ship can do, therefore not breaking his code." - Commodore John Paul Jones

I never heard that jones had to keep to a non violence pact.

 

[Old Salt]

<!--quoteo(post=214044:date=Sep 10 2007, 08:55 PM:name=Commodore John Paul Jones)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Commodore John Paul Jones @ Sep 10 2007, 08:55 PM) [snapback]214044[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I read something about Jack gaining a reputation prior to his sacking of Nassau. His father is already a pirate... wouldn't you fear the son of the worst of all pirates? (To a degree.) And the sight of a black ship under black sails accompanied by a ship that seemed to rise from the depths would do more than enough to make a port shake in its boots. Davy doesn't need to fire a shot if they see what his ship can do, therefore not breaking his code.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I would think just the image of the Dutchman coming up from the depths would be enough to give pause to a number of the soldiers guarding the port. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="icon_wink.gif" /> I'm not so sure that Jones teaming up with Jack, even if he doesn't fire a shot, wouldn't be breaking the deal. This may be nitpicking on my part, and since it is such a good image and rationale for how Jack was rumored to have taken Nassau to be explained, maybe its something we could get away with.
<!--quoteo(post=214044:date=Sep 10 2007, 08:55 PM:name=Commodore John Paul Jones)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Commodore John Paul Jones @ Sep 10 2007, 08:55 PM) [snapback]214044[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I also think that there should be a period after raising the <i>Wench</i> and before Davy over reacts and turns on Jack and Tia... allowing a friendship between the two, which makes Jones' bitterness later even more extreme and shocking. (To imagine that once these two achieved the most feared alliance in the Caribbean!)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, a friendship would make Jones more bitter at Jack after he betrays him then just if they had a simple alliance. So the two of them being friendls is more of a possibility worth exploring.