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Shipmodels for the worldmap

Collision detection??? Didn't even know that there was a problem with that.
I simply loaded your WM ships into Inez tool with "load GM", resized them with "Scene, Edit Scene" and "saved as GM" again.

Maybe they fit into the stock Worldmap collision detection now because they are smaller?
 
Could be. Either that or what you did somehow gave the models the right collision detection. Could you try resizing the Black Pearl in the exact same way and check what happens to the collision detection then? Just to be sure. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
This is what I wrote as ReadMe for the new mapships mod. Any comments please?

<!--c1--><div class='codetop'>CODE</div><div class='codemain'><!--ec1-->=======================================
Shipmodels for the worldmap - VERSION 2
=======================================

A bit more Age of Sail atmosphere


This mod was originally made by Couchcaptain Charles, because one thing he didn't like about the PotC worldmap is that the ships remind him of toddler toyships, especially in contrast to the beautiful ships of the seaview. So he cobbled new shipmodels for the map together, by combining the nice seaview hull models with a rig made of "Inez Tool" elements. This mod was quite a major improvement over the original toy ships, but not everybody agreed because they thought it was not entirely perfect yet. So one year after the original mod's release, here is version 2. The mod has been completely redone, this time with rigging modeled on top of the ships in 3D Studio MAX, and hopefully this version will put to rest all the comments people have had about the previous version.

Each nation has a distinct shiptype by means of which you can determine the nationality of the mapencounters
(if you have set WDMAP_SHIP_SHOW_MODE to 0 in BuildSettings.h)

dutch.gm        :    Fleut        with Dutch flag
portuguese.gm    :    Caravel        with Portuguese flag
pirates.gm        :    Schooner    with pirate flag and black sails
british.gm        :    Brig        with British flag
french.gm        :    Frigate        with French flag
spanish.gm    :    Galleon        with national emblems

The playership model "ship.gm" is a Privateer. That's also the default model for all ships if you set WDMAP_SHIP_SHOW_MODE not to 0.

The mapships have also been made smaller than the old ones so that they don't dwarf the islands.

Credits:
--------
- Original idea and version 1 by Couchcaptain Charles
- Version 2 by Pieter Boelen
- Dutch Fleut skin by Petros
- Portuguese Caravel skin by Petros
- Pirate Schooner skin by Rafe Bligh
- British Brig skin by Thomas the Terror
- French Frigate skin by Seb
- Spanish Galleon skin by Petros
- National flags by Merciless Mark
- Rescaling of the ships by Couchcaptain Charles


=======================================
MAPSPEED TWEAK
=======================================

Another thing that Couchcaptain Charles didn't like was that the ships were rushing over the map like pacman and the ghosts. His idea of an Age of Sail speed is that vessels drift gracefully along with a quiet pace. The main characteristic of an Age of Sail voyage was its slowness. Besides he likes to have some time to watch other ships and plan his course.

So he added two tweaksettings where everybody can set his favourite mapspeed and voyagelength. They are at the beginning of the PROGRAM\worldmap\worldmap.c file:

#define MAPSPEED        0.6    // ccc mapships, slows worldmap down, stock setting 1.0
#define MAP_VOYAGELENGTH    8.0    // ccc, lets voyages take longer, stock setting 4.0

If you don't want to use the speedtweaks, change these settings back to stock settings.


Jan 06  Couchcaptain Charles   www.piratesahoy.com/forum<!--c2--></div><!--ec2-->
 
Player's ship skin? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/whistling.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wp" border="0" alt="whistling.gif" />
 
i think petros would be pleased to know that the frigate and the galleon where indeed the right size in comparison to each other. to the millimeter, in fact. but that doesn't say that the galleon wasn't too big. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheeky" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo(post=181197:date=Jan 30 2007, 12:37 PM:name=morgan terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(morgan terror @ Jan 30 2007, 12:37 PM) [snapback]181197[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
i think petros would be pleased to know that the frigate and the galleon where indeed the right size in comparison to each other. to the millimeter, in fact. but that doesn't say that the galleon wasn't too big. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheeky" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I may be right but that is all academic at this point.

I would not have even bothered, if Pieter would have only come out from the start saying that he wanted all the ships to be the same size, just like the toyships.

Instead, it sounded like a question about the accuracy of the relative differences in size, between ships..
 
well, the accuracy was right, but it doesn't matter anymore. i'm always surprised at how small that caravel actually is.
 
<!--quoteo(post=181138:date=Jan 30 2007, 12:30 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Jan 30 2007, 12:30 PM) [snapback]181138[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Could be. Either that or what you did somehow gave the models the right collision detection. Could you try resizing the Black Pearl in the exact same way and check what happens to the collision detection then? Just to be sure. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry, I think I have missed the discussion about any Black Pearl problems. You mean not a worldmapship but the Black Pearl hullmodel for the 3D seaview, right?
 
<!--quoteo(post=181190:date=Jan 30 2007, 06:00 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 30 2007, 06:00 PM) [snapback]181190[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Player's ship skin? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/whistling.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wp" border="0" alt="whistling.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Woops. Forgot that. I added it to the ReadMe now; it'll be in the final release.

<!--quoteo(post=181200:date=Jan 30 2007, 06:58 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 30 2007, 06:58 PM) [snapback]181200[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
I would not have even bothered, if Pieter would have only come out from the start saying that he wanted all the ships to be the same size, just like the toyships. Instead, it sounded like a question about the accuracy of the relative differences in size, between ships..
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry about the confusion. I had never intended the ships to have different sizes; I always wanted them to have the same size. I apologize for not making myself clear. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/oops3.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":eek:ops2" border="0" alt="oops3.gif" />

<!--quoteo(post=181260:date=Jan 31 2007, 08:32 AM:name=CouchcaptainCharles)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(CouchcaptainCharles @ Jan 31 2007, 08:32 AM) [snapback]181260[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Sorry, I think I have missed the discussion about any Black Pearl problems. You mean not a worldmapship but the Black Pearl hullmodel for the 3D seaview, right?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The original Black Pearl in the game is a black ship with black sails, but other than that she has no resemblance to the real Black Pearl as used in the films. So Kazeite has made a completely new model of the Black Pearl that <i>IS</i> the film version of the ship. She works just fine, apart from the collision detection and the first person player camera. The collision detection was taken from another ship, but it doesn't match the Pearl's shape exactly. And the same goes for the walk file for the first person player camera with the result that the player can move through walls and walk up invisible stairs and such. She might be a ghost ship, but that is not intentional.

The new Black Pearl is in Build 13 under the name "theBlackPearl". You can test her out by setting her as a starting ship option in InternalSettings.h. It would be great if we could sort out the collision detection issues on her. It might be possible somehow, but Kazeite didn't manage to figure out how to do it with Inez's Tool and I hardly even know how the Tool works. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
pieter, i noticed that the new black pearl, when i met it at falaise de fleur, had the patched up sails instead of the torn ones. this might have something to do with something that nelson has done, but i doubt it.
 
<!--quoteo(post=181138:date=Jan 30 2007, 06:30 AM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Jan 30 2007, 06:30 AM) [snapback]181138[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Could be. Either that or what you did somehow gave the models the right collision detection. Could you try resizing the Black Pearl in the exact same way and check what happens to the collision detection then? Just to be sure. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm confused. What is meant by collision detection?

All the POTC ships seem to be able to enter parts of other ships.
That is why water appears in ships whose water line is not set right. The hull doesn't really hold back water or anything.

Are you saying that your mapships could sail right through each other, and that CCC's don't?


If collision detection means where you walk on deck, which doesn't apply to mapships anyway, I understand that to be controlled by the invisible "shipname_path.gm" file for each ship.

Where the crew walk is defined by the "Shipname_walk.c" files
 
hey Morgan! the patched sails are there because they are set as the stock sails for the ship in Ships_init. since you face the BP exactly as it's entered in Ships_init, you WILL see patched sails instead of torn ones. if there was some way to make it so that this ship uses torn sails WITHOUT making it default, while the ship is an NPC, then you could switch it to patched sails AFTER you capture it, if you choose to do so [who wouldnt want to capture the Fastest Ship in the Caribbean? <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/jackhat.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":j2" border="0" alt="jackhat.gif" /> ].

i really wish there was a way to fix the collision detection on her. helluva ship, but the lack of proper collision detection is bugging me. the most annoying thing is the fact that the waves going against the hull arent alligned with the hull...
 
i thought it was already programmed in that it would have torn sails originally, and patched sails after you captured it. or did that never leave the drawing board?
 
<!--quoteo(post=181301:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:19 PM:name=morgan terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(morgan terror @ Jan 31 2007, 04:19 PM) [snapback]181301[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
pieter, i noticed that the new black pearl, when i met it at falaise de fleur, had the patched up sails instead of the torn ones. this might have something to do with something that nelson has done, but i doubt it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is because the new Black Pearl is set to use the patched sails in the ships_init.c file. It was intentionally done so by me and Kazeite. When the new BP will replace the old BP, we'll set her to use torn sails while she isn't the player ship and replace the torn sails with patched sails when the player captures her. But until that time she just have patched sails. But you can change that in ships_init.c.

<!--quoteo(post=181310:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]181310[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
I'm confused. What is meant by collision detection? All the POTC ships seem to be able to enter parts of other ships.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Just for clarity's sake: When I talk about Kazeite's new Black Pearl, it has NOTHING to do with the mapships. The collision detection defines where the ship starts and ends so that ships will bump into each other. It also defines where the player camera can move in 1st person sailing mode. If the collision detection is not correct, other ships could either bump away too far from the ship, or sail through parts of the ship. It could also make it so that the 1st person camera doesn't move accordingly to the real ship's deck, but according to an invisible ship's deck that is not correct. Normally the invisible deck and the real deck are the same, but not on the new Black Pearl.

<!--quoteo(post=181310:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]181310[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Are you saying that your mapships could sail right through each other, and that CCC's don't?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

<!--quoteo(post=181310:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]181310[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Are you saying that your mapships could sail right through each other, and that CCC's don't?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mapships can sail through each other, whether the collision detection is correct or not. But not through land. My original fullsize mapships could sail partly through the islands, but CCC's resized versions can not. There are two possible explanations for that:
1) The resizing made it so that the ships do fit into their collision detection bounding box thingey
2) The resizing somehow generated correct collision detection

If option 2 applies, this might also work for Kazeite's Black Pearl.

<!--quoteo(post=181310:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]181310[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
If collision detection means where you walk on deck, which doesn't apply to mapships anyway, I understand that to be controlled by the invisible "shipname_path.gm" file for each ship.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wonder if that file is correct for the Black Pearl. I expect there something wrong with that.

<!--quoteo(post=181310:date=Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM:name=Petros)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Petros @ Jan 31 2007, 04:36 PM) [snapback]181310[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
Where the crew walk is defined by the "Shipname_walk.c" files
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The Black Pearl does have a correct crew walk file.

<!--quoteo(post=181354:date=Jan 31 2007, 09:33 PM:name=morgan terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(morgan terror @ Jan 31 2007, 09:33 PM) [snapback]181354[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
i thought it was already programmed in that it would have torn sails originally, and patched sails after you captured it. or did that never leave the drawing board?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That has not been programmed in, but that is the eventual intent.
 
speaking of collsion detection, i have noticed that the detection of the warship is wrong. even at a considerable distance behind a warship, you will still hit it. the rear is the only problem with it.
 
<!--quoteo(post=181278:date=Jan 31 2007, 10:55 AM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Jan 31 2007, 10:55 AM) [snapback]181278[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->
The collision detection was taken from another ship, but it doesn't match the Pearl's shape exactly. And the same goes for the walk file for the first person player camera with the result that the player can move through walls and walk up invisible stairs and such. She might be a ghost ship, but that is not intentional.

The new Black Pearl is in Build 13 under the name "theBlackPearl". You can test her out by setting her as a starting ship option in InternalSettings.h. It would be great if we could sort out the collision detection issues on her. It might be possible somehow, but Kazeite didn't manage to figure out how to do it with Inez's Tool and I hardly even know how the Tool works. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sorry, resizing the hull doesn't fix the collision detection <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/dunno.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shrug" border="0" alt="dunno.gif" />
 
Shame. But at least we tried now. Thanks for checking it. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/doff.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":doff" border="0" alt="doff.gif" />
 
Sigh...

Anyway, to clarify - crew walk files have nothing common with collision detection. It's simply a set of intangible waypoints intangible crewmen use to "walk" (as in "float from one waypoint to another while using walk animation").

Apart from that, every object you see in the sea scenes must have working collision data, otherwise it won't be accepted by the game.

Theoretically TOOL is capable of making collision data from scratch, but in my case the game doesn't accept any of the generated data, which is why I was forced to use collision data of other objects.

The same thing applies to ships path, which is a invisible but tangible area you can walk on in 1st person view. It's separate from the ship and doesn't even need it, but we need it to be able to move camera around in 1st person view.
 
Well, IMHO the "new" black pearl collision detection is acceptable. True, you can sail through the "beak", but I've seen worse oddities in stock games, let alone mods. (especially in mine <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheeky" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" /> )

As for the _path.gm file, I can imagine it is difficult to find/create one that fits ALL the decks AND the connecting stairs. But for gameplay it might be sufficient if you could walk on ONE deck only, so maybe you can use the path of some small, flatdeck ship and lift/stretch it till it fits the Pearl's maindeck ?
The quarterdeck would of course be even better, but I fear the starting position for FPV is always in the center of the ship.
 
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