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Realistic Fortifications

C

capitan_caceres

Sailor
Storm Modder
Ahoy there.

First of all I would like to introduce myself, I am a profesional colonial military historian and amateur 3D desingner who happens to know a lot of new age fortification <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> that is why I don´t understand why most pirate games today have european medieval times castles as shore defenses, with the exception of Sid Meier´s Pirates. So I decided to replace or at least modify every fortification ingame with new more realistic more historically accurate models.

If anyone can help me to better understand and use the modding tools please feel free to do it because so far I am having trouble with the vrml importation.

<img src="http://myspace-560.vo.llnwd.net/00478/06/51/478301560_l.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
 
Ahoy, and welcome to PiratesAhoy! <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/par-ty.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheers" border="0" alt="par-ty.gif" />

Your models look truly great! I'd love to see them in game. <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bounce.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":b:" border="0" alt="bounce.gif" />

You said you got problems with converting .gm <-> .vrml?
Then you should look here:
<a href="http://forum.piratesahoy.net/index.php?showtopic=3310" target="_blank">http://forum.piratesahoy.net/index.php?showtopic=3310</a>
Inez's tool is awesome. <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/danse1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":dance" border="0" alt="danse1.gif" />

Anyways, welcome. <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheeky" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" />

PS. What modelling program do you use?
 
Superb work mate,would look awsome in game <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":onya" border="0" alt="me.gif" /> <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/par-ty.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheers" border="0" alt="par-ty.gif" />
 
<img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hi.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":gday" border="0" alt="hi.gif" /> there

Very nice looking work there, matey. Looking forward to seeing some more.

Cheers and welcome aboard. <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/par-ty.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheers" border="0" alt="par-ty.gif" />
 
Thanks for all the good opinions on my models, I use 3D Max 7 to make them. I do know Inez tool, it´s awesome I must say, but as I have been experiencing some problem while importing the vrml models from max to the tool, somehow the model parts are all scattered, I have read the tutorials on the wiki page, but have not found any on creating new buildings for the sea scenery.

I would also like to know how can I change the locators for the cannons in a fort, I have only seen the ones for the flag so far.

I know this may be too much to ask, but can someone help me personally, I would gladly make models for any other modmaker, I just don´t have much time to do the trial and error thing with the vrml, but I do have a lot of models already made.

THANKS in advance.

<img src="http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/1796/sanlazaro040ae.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/6606/sanlazaro053rj.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
 
I have read on cannon fort tutorials ...but I thing I forgot it for it was 2 years ago.....
 
<img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/w00t.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":woot" border="0" alt="w00t.gif" /> BEAUTIFUL!!! JUST BEAUTIFUL!! Awesome models! Keep up the good work.
 
i do know about your problem with the tool. it was the same like i had with my ship.
You do have to mark evereything, then click groups and delete all groups.
then transform evereything to an editable poly.
now you can click at one piece and attach all others to ist. so you just got 1 obejct.
then it should work.

but, tell me, are your textures working in the tool?
my ship's just white. i can't see my textures....
 
<!--quoteo(post=138981:date=Feb 7 2006, 09:43 AM:name=´Chocolate` Bill)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(´Chocolate` Bill @ Feb 7 2006, 09:43 AM) [snapback]138981[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i do know about your problem with the tool. it was the same like i had with my ship.
You do have to mark evereything, then click groups and delete all groups.
then transform evereything to an editable poly.
now you can click at one piece and attach all others to ist. so you just got 1 obejct.
then it should work.

but, tell me, are your textures working in the tool?
my ship's just white. i can't see my textures....<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

You are absolutely right Chocolate Bill, the problem was the pivot points, they were not centered in the origin I made the whole fort one single object by ataching the pieces, then I moved the pivot point to the origin and then I sepparated them again and the new pieces inherited the pivot point´s origin location.

As for textures I can tell you mine work in the tool in their TGA format, according to what I have read the tool only reads TGA textures but if you want them ingame, just transform them to TX.

Last night I experienced some new problem with my attempts to add the new fort, the tool gives me this error message when I import the VRML97 model from 3D MAX "Model.ReduceNormals: Index was outside the bounds of the array." wich I don´t understand, what bounds of what array? the funny thing is that the model loads good, but then I can´t save it to gm, it keeps saving it into VRML format no matter if I choose "save GM as".

So far all I have done is depriving Redmond of the medieval castle but with no working replacement.

<!--quoteo(post=138964:date=Feb 7 2006, 07:02 AM:name=Vassal)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Vassal @ Feb 7 2006, 07:02 AM) [snapback]138964[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have read on cannon fort tutorials ...but I thing I forgot it for it was 2 years ago.....<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I hope you can remember Vassal, please let me know when you do.
 
I think we need Inez Dias to help out. That's the only person who truly knows how it all works... <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo(post=138999:date=Feb 7 2006, 01:46 PM:name=Pieter Boelen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pieter Boelen @ Feb 7 2006, 01:46 PM) [snapback]138999[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think we need Inez Dias to help out. That's the only person who truly knows how it all works... <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I think you are right Pieter, because last night I realized how much I suck using other programs different from 3D MAX.

But I also noticed that the buildings in POTC are parented to a dummy object named "V2Grp01" this object is a small green square centered at the very origin of the scene, the orthocentre or whatever it´s geometry name is, anyway I kept this object and parented my new fort meshes to it, so it continues to be the fort´s parent object, the questions is, what the hell have I done?
 
I haven't got the slightest idea. Sounds weird. <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/piratesing.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shock" border="0" alt="piratesing.gif" />
 
this could be like a 'center origin piece'
as far as i know, potc is placing its objecs in the middle. no matter where the origin centre is.
maybe if u add this piece, the game will be able to center your fort on ground not half under, half upper...
but, i'm not sure about this

for example, i tried to add masts to my shipmodel and as you can see, potc sunk it.
I belkieve there's a problem tith the scaling, too. as you can see, my ship is very,very big. now i've found out, how to fix it, but it won't be the rights size. the last time i tried it, it was as small as a bottle ship =)

<img src="http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/6ue-o.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
 
Beautiful models for sure <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":onya" border="0" alt="me.gif" /> It would in fact be nice to have proper 17th century fortifications instead of Akellas medievil castles.

RE gunlocators: You can change any locator with Inez' tool. A short tutorial about locators is in the "Inez' Tool" thread above. Its only a lot of trial and error work to find the right model (the GM viewer helps a lot there) and the right position for your new locator.

If you have questions regarding the tool or the VMRL/GM conversion mail or PM Inez Diaz. She rarely visits the forum these days, but she told me that she is still interested and willing to help.

RE your question elsewhere about "adding new towns": You can add new locations by cloning existing ones (see Location cloning tutorial in the Wiki) and you can add new buildings to existing locations by means of the Buildingset. You can also combine two models for one location. E.g. the forts are seperate models added to the islandmodels, and marketstalls or the storepiles of the smugglers are added to towns/beaches only at certain times. They are simply registered in the locationdefinitions in the locations\init folder. Another example is the waterfall for "Douwesen_town_exit" in "locations\init\Douwesen.c". Try to replace that "waterfall.gm" model with your fortmodel to see whether it shows up.

If you can make new GM models for buildings or entire towns you should be able add them by registering in the locationdefinition. But it is probably a hell lot of work to make all the walkpatches, lighting plans, locators etc. It may be much easier if you take one of the existing townmodels and change the looks of it by remodeling.

May I recommend an easy training example? :wink My bastion from the Buildingset is rather ugly and primitive, so you can only improve it if you replace that model (resource\models\ammo\town.gm) with a proper little gunbastion or martello tower. The model has only two locators (start and end), and their position is meaningless. So that would be a simple way to test the basic principles <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
 
To Chocolate Bill, I can help you scale any model you want as well as center it on the scene, I have worked a lot with origin points for other games, like Fleet Command. Also, the game does not center your object, you have to do that, for example, I have noticed that the origin point also defines the ships default flotation line so everything that is on the negative Y axis would be underwater. Masts are different, because they are modeled as sepparate objects and have a different rotation-origin point, with is the point where they make contact with the hull, otherwise the falling mast animation would look weird, like torn away by a strong wind.

I still need confirmation on this eror message "Model.ReduceNormals: Index was outside the bounds of the array."

To CouchcaptainCharles I have a proposition for you, I was looking at your work last night and fell in love with the rum destilery, is a very resourceful approach you used for it, but I would like to make unique new models for each one of your buildings and I will take your advice and make a new tower.

I have my msn and ICQ data in my profile if you want to contact me directly or send the models to you, because so far I have been unable to put them ingame, I just get empty space.
 
Bad news, I opened CouchcaptainCharles bastions and exported it to VRML so I can use the same scale and the TOOL gave me an error message, the same thing about index out of range. So I am officially giving up VRML now that format has become too frustrating for me with it´s inverted axis and such, I am sticking to 3d max I will still make the tower, but I guess somebody else is going to handle the import-export.

So who wants to be my exporter <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> ?
 
i wanna play your new city looks gigantic to me but if possible try to turn it into a new island
make's it easer to find <img src="http://www.piratesahoy.com/forum/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />
 
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