Guide New complete guide for ships on POTC New Horizons

[HellSailor]

GAMMA FINAL version of the Complete Ship Guide for Pirates of the Caribbean: New Horizons now released! (Release Date: 7th March 2022).

It is done. This is my final release. No further changes will be done to the guide. Only small fixes will be done if errors are found. So for me, @Grey Roger , you can feel free to add these final versions of my guide to the next release of the mod. I have included the latest changes of 'Ships_init.c', which are not yet released. In my opinion, these latest changes are completely fine, and makes the ships stats' balance much more better.

There are now two files for this final release. The first one will be the ENGLISH version of the guide, whereas the second one will be the SPANISH version of the guide. The English one is final, while the spanish version needs to be checked for possible errors or mispells. If nothing is said, it could also be considered final.

You can now check it out, and give feedback on what do you think of it. Advices, suggestions and recommendations are welcomed for improving this guide.

---

So while I was exploring the files of the game, I noticed on the folder 'Documentation' a .pdf file called 'New Horizons Ship Recognition Guide'. The file itself is very old, from 2010, and, while it has some useful information, nowadays is completly obsolete, due to the new patches and ships that have come over these years.

So, during my free time, I started writing and developing a complete guide for ALL the standard ships that you can find in the game, for all tiers and periods (from 1500 to 1830).

I think it could be a very useful tool to have for new players to understand a little bit more about the ships in game, their special characteristics, and the possible strategies you can use with each one of them. I have it now, but it's still in an ALPHA state, and only in my mother tongue, Spanish. Nevertheless, I could translate it to english, and show it to you. You can offer me a brainstorming of ideas, advices and suggestions about how I can make this guide perfect. I still have to do the screenshots for each one of the ships, for example. But I would really like to be sure if you're interested in this idea to continue further development.

What do you think @Grey Roger @Pieter Boelen ? If you think there's anyone else interested in this, feel free to text them.

 

[HellSailor]

As of right now, I will attempt to do all the screenshots by myself about all the ships of the game. I now figured out that the F9 key takes out the HUD, so that will be much more inmersive (just so for anyone that is interested). If anyone feels like giving me a hand on this, I will appreciate it. Just DM and we can coordinate that. It seems the F8 can do screenshots, but I can't find the folder in which they go. If anyone can help me on that I will appreciate it a lot.

Also I will begin to translate the guide into English. It shouldn't take long, and thus, I think I can manage to create the ALPHA guide before New Year. If anyone has any advices, suggestions or ideas, you're free to post them here.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

There was somewhere a system to automatically (re-)create an overview of all ships by directly extracting the PROGRAM\Ships\ships_init.c code.
Can't remember who made that right now; but it was an HTTP website; and he gave me the source code fairly recently.
Must be hiding in a backup of mine somewhere. I'll look it up one of these days.

As for screenshots of the ships, why do what has already been done?
You can see one of each ship already in the game; so you could just use those instead.
You can find them in RESOURCE\Textures\INTERFACES , in these files:
shipsBL.tga.tx
shipsBR.tga.tx
shipsTL.tga.tx
shipsTM.tga.tx
shipsTR.tga.tx

Use the TX Converter to view those; and convert them back to a usable file format.

Alternatively, PROGRAM\console.c switch case 1 contains this sample code:

            if(!Checkattribute(pchar,"cheatship")) Pchar.cheatship = 0;
            int con = sti(Pchar.cheatship);
            if(con<SHIP_TYPES_QUANTITY)
            {
                GiveShip2Character(pchar,ShipsTypes[con].id,"Test Ship",-1,ENGLAND,true,true);
                Pchar.cheatship = con +1;
            }
            TraceAndLog("*************************** Ship : " + ShipsTypes[con].id + " , Index : " + con + " ");

Using that, every time you press F12, you are automatically given the next ship in the game (regardless of encounter chances; or period appropriateness).
To actually view the ship model, you have to reload the scene; for example by reloading from 3D Sailing Mode to WorldMap and back again.
This way, you can check EVERY ship in the game REALLY very rapidly.

I added this code specifically for the purpose of quick screenshot-making; because otherwise making those "ships*.tga.tx" files just would've taken TOO much time.
And especially without modifying the code, you would've been dependent on random chance to find the ones you need too.
That's perfectly fine for a proper player.
Not so much when you want to develop something though.

Remember also that if you ENABLE_CHEATMODE at the bottom of PROGRAM\InternalSettings.h ,
the ship tier limitation in the Select Storyline Free Play interface no longer applies.
This allows players to find whatever ship they want using the various filters provided in that interface:

It's a pretty powerful search system that also allows free text search in name and description,
so even were there 1000+ ships in the game, you could always narrow down what you are looking for.

If you then also enable DEBUG in PROGRAM\globals.c , instead of the pretty display name,
you'll get the internal ship ID instead which always matches the folder name from RESOURCE\MODELS\Ships that can be viewed with GM Viewer.
In addition, this toggle also affects the Ship Repaint interface, where suddenly you'll be able to "repaint" literally ANY ship into literally any other one.
And again you'll be seeing those internal ship IDs in addition to the nice display names:

What do you think @Grey Roger @Pieter Boelen ?

I wonder if this is not a form of "water naar de zee dragen".
In other words: sure it can be done, but to what point and purpose?

As long as @Grey Roger and @Mad Jack Wolfe keep updating the PotC Build 14 base,
any list you make is doomed to become outdated again soon enough.

It seems the F8 can do screenshots, but I can't find the folder in which they go. If anyone can help me on that I will appreciate it a lot.

They appear in your main game folder; in TGA format.

Also I will begin to translate the guide into English.

Which language were you originally writing in then?

 

[HellSailor]

There was somewhere a system to automatically (re-)create an overview of all ships by directly extracting the PROGRAM\Ships\ships_init.c code.
Can't remember who made that right now; but it was an HTTP website; and he gave me the source code fairly recently.
Must be hiding in a backup of mine somewhere. I'll look it up one of these days.

As for screenshots of the ships, why do what has already been done?
You can see one of each ship already in the game; so you could just use those instead.
You can find them in RESOURCE\Textures\INTERFACES , in these files:
shipsBL.tga.tx
shipsBR.tga.tx
shipsTL.tga.tx
shipsTM.tga.tx
shipsTR.tga.tx

Use the TX Converter to view those; and convert them back to a usable file format.

Alternatively, PROGRAM\console.c switch case 1 contains this sample code:

if(!Checkattribute(pchar,"cheatship")) Pchar.cheatship = 0;
int con = sti(Pchar.cheatship);
if(con<SHIP_TYPES_QUANTITY)
{
GiveShip2Character(pchar,ShipsTypes[con].id,"Test Ship",-1,ENGLAND,true,true);
Pchar.cheatship = con +1;
}
TraceAndLog("*************************** Ship : " + ShipsTypes[con].id + " , Index : " + con + " ");

Using that, every time you press F12, you are automatically given the next ship in the game (regardless of encounter chances; or period appropriateness).
To actually view the ship model, you have to reload the scene; for example by reloading from 3D Sailing Mode to WorldMap and back again.
This way, you can check EVERY ship in the game REALLY very rapidly.

I added this code specifically for the purpose of quick screenshot-making; because otherwise making those "ships*.tga.tx" files just would've taken TOO much time.
And especially without modifying the code, you would've been dependent on random chance to find the ones you need too.
That's perfectly fine for a proper player.
Not so much when you want to develop something though.

Remember also that if you ENABLE_CHEATMODE at the bottom of PROGRAM\InternalSettings.h ,
the ship tier limitation in the Select Storyline Free Play interface no longer applies.
This allows players to find whatever ship they want using the various filters provided in that interface:

It's a pretty powerful search system that also allows free text search in name and description,
so even were there 1000+ ships in the game, you could always narrow down what you are looking for.

If you then also enable DEBUG in PROGRAM\globals.c , instead of the pretty display name,
you'll get the internal ship ID instead which always matches the folder name from RESOURCE\MODELS\Ships that can be viewed with GM Viewer.
In addition, this toggle also affects the Ship Repaint interface, where suddenly you'll be able to "repaint" literally ANY ship into literally any other one.
And again you'll be seeing those internal ship IDs in addition to the nice display names:

Thanks a lot! This should make it easier to do what I want.

I wonder if this is not a form of "water naar de zee dragen".
In other words: sure it can be done, but to what point and purpose?

As long as @Grey Roger and @Mad Jack Wolfe keep updating the PotC Build 14 base,
any list you make is doomed to become outdated again soon enough.

That's a fair point. In my opinion, since 2010 there hasn't been any updates to that list whatsoever. So, even just to update it to 2021-2022 would make a dramatic difference. Sure, by the next patch, that list would become obsolete, but it will be less obsolete than having a 10+ list without updating it.

Besides, if the document becomes obsolete, I wouldn't mind repeating the same work inside the wiki page. I remember there is a link to a web page that can dispaly every single model of ship available in the game, depending on the Build version you're using. But that doesn't give you any screenshots, info, or possible strategies with every ship.

Which language were you originally writing in then?

It was in Spanish; that is my mother tongue. The spanish ALPHA version, without screenshots, is now finished. Now I'm working on a translation of said file into English; that's the common worldwide language.

 

[Grey Roger]

I agree that updating the document to include ships added since 2010 is worthwhile. Next chance I get to upload stuff, there will be a few more ships but they're just retextures of existing types, not completely new ships

 

[HellSailor]

Update status: So far is going well. I have done a lot of screenshots of ships of the second period, "The Spanish Main", thanks to the 'Assassin' storyline. I tried to use some of @Pieter Boelen techniques mentioned in earlier posts to have unlocked all ship models for me to take screenshots, but alas, I didn't manage it to work. Maybe is because I'm ignorant about the basics of modding, and I have no clue as to why isn't working. If someone can elaborate with detailed instructions on how to make it work, I will appreciate it a lot.

Fortunately, now that I have control of Alice Town by myself, the shipyard can offer almost all ships available on that period, so that's a plus. The bad thing is, the Screenshots are taken in Alice Town's port, most of them, so it's not as special as one would like to have. But I think is good enough for what I want to achieve.

About the release date for ALPHA version: It's going to take me some time. I might try to have it on middle January, but I can't promise that. I still have also to take screenshots for periods like 'Colonial Powers' and 'Napoleonics', so that's going to take further time.

I will attach here some of the screenshots I have done, if someone wants to take a sneak peek of what I have done so far, and give me opinions or suggestions. It's not finished, just to point it out.

 

[KillPhil]

I still think it is a lot easier to take the existing screenshots of the ships.. just convert them to tga, open it with e.g. XNView and then cut out the ship you want (e.g. with snipping tool)

 

[HellSailor]

I still think it is a lot easier to take the existing screenshots of the ships.. just convert them to tga, open it with e.g. XNView and then cut out the ship you want (e.g. with snipping tool)

I will try to do that. Not good at modding or editing, but I think I can defend myself. Thanks for the tip.

 

[Grey Roger]

The fast war galleon in your screenshot appears to be @GhostOfDeath91's Uncursed Mariana. You won't normally see that in the game. (Nor will you normally see "FastGalleon5". That's mine, specifically for the "Ardent" storyline.) Perhaps use "FastGalleon2" or "FastGalleon4", which are generic French and Spanish versions? There are also "FastGalleon1" and "FastGalleon3" which are non-war versions with smaller guns, more cargo capacity and higher speed.

 

[HellSailor]

The fast war galleon in your screenshot appears to be @GhostOfDeath91's Uncursed Mariana. You won't normally see that in the game. (Nor will you normally see "FastGalleon5". That's mine, specifically for the "Ardent" storyline.) Perhaps use "FastGalleon2" or "FastGalleon4", which are generic French and Spanish versions? There are also "FastGalleon1" and "FastGalleon3" which are non-war versions with smaller guns, more cargo capacity and higher speed.

Don't worry, I double checked on those. I have selected another model for my screenshot of the Fast War Galleon, which is more accurate, and that you can find on encounters and on shipyards. For the Fast Galleon, I have also selected a screenshot that represents perfectly that model, in such a way as to not cause confusion between the two similar type of ships.

As for @KillPhil suggestion, and @Pieter Boelen as well, in the end, I decided to use the existing screenshots that are available, as I managed to extract those images, and have perfect screenshots for every single ship that is going to appear on the list. So far, is going really good.

My concern would be that, after I finished the list, I fear the file would take too much space to be uploaded directly into the forums. There are, for now, +130 pages for the ALPHA version, and that isn't even finished yet. That's including every single standard ship for all tiers and periods available in the game, and excluding retextures and repaintings of the same ship type.

 

[Grey Roger]

@Pieter Boelen: could @HellSailor be given write access to the "bowengames" FTP site? That would allow him to upload his files there, as I do with my updates.

 

[KillPhil]

@HellSailor some ships are actually "just" design / paint variants of others (e.g. the Pinnaces) .. you could maybe save some space if you summarize them

 

[HellSailor]

@HellSailor some ships are actually "just" design / paint variants of others (e.g. the Pinnaces) .. you could maybe save some space if you summarize them

I know, and I took into account that. But, for example, there are cases in which you have to differentiate between two different models of the same ship type. For example, the "Snow Brig" has two models: Shnyava1, and Shnyava2. As it appears in ships_init.c, the two models have different characteristics, even if they are the same ship class. The number 1 has Max Caliber 9, and 1250 cargo capacity; whereas the number 2 has Max Caliber 6, and 1450 cargo capacity. It's important to distinguish between the two of them to not have any confusions, and differentiate each of them.

Also, as by your example mentioned above, the vanilla Pinnance models do not have the same characteristics as, for example, the NL_Pinnance model. Overall, yes, you could argue that the strategies for the Pinnances could be almost the same: they are merchant ships, so they should be escorted, and they have good cargo capacity. But the vanilla Pinnances have 5000 cargo capacity, whereas the NL_Pinnance has 'only' 3000. They are pinnances, yes, but they are not the same, and don't have the same characteristics, so it's useful to distinguish them.

 

[HellSailor]

Update status #2: It's going really well. I have finished the ALPHA version of the spanish guide. Now it's just a matter of double ckeck for mistakes, and then translate it into english. Now the file takes a little more than 9 Mb on Word, and 4,5 Mb as a .pdf file. Not sure if it will cause problems uploading it here, but I will give it a try. Maybe by Sunday I could have the ALPHA version of the guide in English. I think it's well estructured and organised, but I would like to get feedback once I publish it.

 

[HellSailor]

ALPHA version of the Complete Ship Guide for Pirates of the Caribbean: New Horizons now released!

Check the first post for downloading it. You can now check it out, and give feedback on what do you think of it. Advices, suggestions and recommendations are welcomed for improving this guide.

 

[Grey Roger]

Nice work!

You may want to check the "Analysis by nation" against the actual modifiers seen at the top of "Ships_init.c". For example:
England: "Cargo +": actual modifier 1.20
France: "Cargo -": actual modifier 1.05
Pirates: "Cargo ---": actual modifier 1.0

Gunboat: there's a comment on the very high cargo capacity, which in fact only applies if the experimental mod to count ships' cannons against their cargo capacity is enabled. Except that the condition seems to be the wrong way round so that the lower capacity of 100 is applied if the mod is enabled! That will be corrected in the next update.

Fast Galleon: "it is recommended that it be escorted by dedicated military ships of the same tier, since it is slow and not very maneuverable." In fact it is fast, as its name suggests - it's faster than the Fast War Galleon. It's also a superb ship for pirates - enough firepower to overpower a merchant or have some defence against a warship, fast enough to run away from ships that seriously outgun it, and plenty of space in the hold for loot. Not only does it not need an escort, it sometimes shows up as an escort itself. (Except, of course, that NPC merchants have low crew morale and need to be escorted because they're likely to surrender if they take casualties, which incidentally means that a pirate can help himself to a Fast Galleon by finding one acting as a merchant and hitting it with grapeshot.)

 

[HellSailor]

You may want to check the "Analysis by nation" against the actual modifiers seen at the top of "Ships_init.c". For example:
England: "Cargo +": actual modifier 1.20
France: "Cargo -": actual modifier 1.05
Pirates: "Cargo ---": actual modifier 1.0

What would be your suggestion? My idea was about making a media of the value shown for cargo capacity for all nation designs. Since 1.00 is the base value, but only 'Pirates' and 'Personal' would get that value, I thought about taking another value instead. But if you thing it's best to work with the base value, I have no problem in changing it.

Gunboat: there's a comment on the very high cargo capacity, which in fact only applies if the experimental mod to count ships' cannons against their cargo capacity is enabled. Except that the condition seems to be the wrong way round so that the lower capacity of 100 is applied if the mod is enabled! That will be corrected in the next update.

That's perfect. For now I will leave it as it is. When the fix is up, I will change it properly.

Fast Galleon: "it is recommended that it be escorted by dedicated military ships of the same tier, since it is slow and not very maneuverable." In fact it is fast, as its name suggests - it's faster than the Fast War Galleon. It's also a superb ship for pirates - enough firepower to overpower a merchant or have some defence against a warship, fast enough to run away from ships that seriously outgun it, and plenty of space in the hold for loot. Not only does it not need an escort, it sometimes shows up as an escort itself. (Except, of course, that NPC merchants have low crew morale and need to be escorted because they're likely to surrender if they take casualties, which incidentally means that a pirate can help himself to a Fast Galleon by finding one acting as a merchant and hitting it with grapeshot.)

I double checked on its stats on Ships_init.c, and it seems they both have the same speed and maneuverability. I think, IIRC, that the Fast War Galleon has a very slow acceleration, so I think that could make it worse in that regard. But about the rest of things you mentioned, they are quite interesting, and I didn't notice it. That's why I think different opinions are more than welcome, because other people can see excellent strategies with ships that I don't. I will make little changes for the Fast Galleon.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I think attached was the source code for that ships_init.c-based online interface.

ALPHA version of the Complete Ship Guide for Pirates of the Caribbean: New Horizons now released!

Check the first post for downloading it. You can now check it out, and give feedback on what do you think of it. Advices, suggestions and recommendations are welcomed for improving this guide.

Wow; impressive work!
Beautifully designed.

Wasn't it supposed to be "Soleil Royal" instead of "Royal Soleil"?

 

[Grey Roger]

Cargo modifiers: it probably doesn't matter too much whether you use a median value or the base value, as long as the relative merits of the various nations are shown. Technically it's more correct to use the base value because that's what the game does.

Gunboat: perhaps I can add the Guide to the "Documentation" folder of the game installation in the next update? That's when the fix for the gunboat's cargo will also go into the game, so if you change its description, it will already be accurate, it won't need to wait for the next next update.

Fast Galleon: speed 12.5, turn rate 80, capacity 5000, armament 38 x 9lb
Fast War Galleon: speed 11.5, turn rate 80, capacity 4000, armament 38 x 18lb
Frigate1: speed 13, turn rate 72, capacity 1750, armament 36 x 12lb

So the fast galleon is faster than the fast war galleon and slightly slower than the Kreyser class frigate. The fast war galleon isn't that much slower than the frigate, outguns it with 18lb cannons, and has a lot more cargo space.

The fast war galleon should never show up as a merchant. It used to be dual purpose but that meant you could get possibly the most awesome ship in the first three periods far too easily by finding it in a group of unescorted merchants. I changed it to be a pure warship some time ago.

The frigate's big advantage is that it has stay sails, which give it better performance in a cross wind. The galleons are harder to tack.

 

[KillPhil]

I think you overexaggerated a few cons and pros .. maybe thats just the translation

e.g. (swedish) East Indiaman:

Pros:
• Quite good cargo capacity.
• Very good HP. -> about 3000 HP isnt exactly "very good" imo .. the East Indiaman is pretty strong compared to more slender merchants but e.g. a Pinnace is a lot tougher
• Quite notable defensive armament.
• High crew number.

Cons:
• Very low maritime performance -> It actually performs very decent if you take the overall statistics (HP, crew, cargo, cannon calibre and count) into it..