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i immediately recognised that ship as a galleon, but i'd say it's at least mid-1500's. the construction and decoration was only at that standard until later. also, that fourth mast is called a bonaventura. the english where the first to no longer use it, introducing the square mizzen topsail.
 
Wow. Thanks Morgan, you know your stuff! Yeah, it said bonaventura mast, but my english dictionary said counter mizzen so I just presumed...

But tell me, are you assuming the ship is mid-16th-century-made from the paintings by van de Velde?
 
i wouldn't be very familiar with artists that depicted ships. only with rigging construction, history, and naming, along with the basic hull shapes. anyway, it has just as much chance of being the same ship as not. the design was quite common for large warships.
 
Van de Velde, Elder and Younger are painters from the 17th century. They both never made paintings of ships of that age.
 
i also noticed something else. that ship in the painting can't be the same ship type, since it's rigged with a mizzen topsail. look closely.
 
Yes, my mistake. The painting shows the second version of Prince Royal. She was launched 1610 as Prince Royal and this painting is after the rebuild 1660.

EDIT: No, it was rebuild 1641.
 
makes sense. i've never heard of ships being updated to that rigging type, but i don't see any reason why not.
 
<a href="http://www.kotiposti.net/felipe/Pictures/Royal_Prince_1610/royal_prince_1610.html" target="_blank">This</a> is the 1610 Prince Royal (or Royal Prince)
 
that's a VERY wierd rig. never seen anything like it. i do, however, understand why it excists. it always seemed a little odd to me that they just ditched the bonaventura when the mizzen topsail was invented.
 
Supersticious beliefs among seamen in old times:
We landish scurvvybags have probably heard the old saying "Do not walk under a ladder, it brings bad luck!". Or how a black cat crossing our path is a warning of something bad to happen, soon.

Likewise for a young man at sea, learning seamanship were not all about climbing masts and pull ropes, it was also important to learn about ways of foreseeing bad luck, in order to prevent it. In today´s terms, we would call these old folks supersticious - but back then, they had every reason to be!
Life aboard a ship were isolated, a sort of mini-society far away from home. The deathrate among seamen were extremely high, compared to life on land. In addition, today´s marine archeologists tell us, that more seamen and soldiers died from scurvvy, accidents and sickness than in battles at sea. And, with today´s standards regarding safety aboard, knowledge of quality in life and healthcare, this deathrate can easily be explained.

Back then, life was fragile and could not always be easily explained:

- Do not whistle at sea. It will bring storm and bad accidents to the crew. The only one allowed to whistle, is the boatswain.
- Never start your journey on a friday - Jesus was crucified on a friday!
- Never start your journey on the first monday in april - that day, Cain killed Abel!
- Never start your journey on the second monday in august - that day, Sodoma and Gomorra was destroyed!
- Never start your journey on december 31st - that day, Judas Iskariot hanged himself!

- It is considered a misfortune to have a priest aboard, as well as umbrellas and flowers.
- Women makes the sea angry! On the contrary, a _naked_ woman makes the sea calm and any storm will lie down before her.
(This explains the lot of naked figureheads on ships <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> )
- A black cat aboard is considered to bring luck and bring everyone home. But if a dog is seen near the fishingequipment, it is bad luck!

An old danish saying goes, that there can not be more seamen from the Isle of Bornholm on a vessel than the number of its masts(they were considered wild and untamed).

The eyes painted on Chinese junks are not for pure decoration purposes. "Suppose no eye no can see!", the chinese fisherman explains.

Tradition tell us to put "a coin" under the mast, when the ship is build. It will bring bring good fortune. This is not true. The coin should be at least a silvercoin - as payment to the ferryman for helping the souls of the crew crossing the river Styx into the Kingdom of the Dead, Hades. For my own part as a young sailor, I bought my very first earring of gold, once I heard how King Neptune under no circumstances would bring my dead body to the shores of Denmark for less, should I drown..Also, it would pay my funeral <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

In old times, seamen often had the chance of learning to swin, but they refused. "The sea takes what the sea wants". And swimming before drowning would only bring unnecessary recess in time to this process of Gods will..!

If anyone know of more supersticius and odd beliefs among seamen in old times, please dont hesitate <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
 
Ok, did´nt mean to close the conversation in here, just meant to give you guys a break from the trivial stuff..

Hope no harm is done, meant none <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />
 
Not at all. Interesting stuff. The thread does say to write anything you want. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/yes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":yes" border="0" alt="yes.gif" />
 
Was probably just a lull in posting. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/yes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":yes" border="0" alt="yes.gif" />
 
<!--quoteo(post=288275:date=Nov 9 2008, 01:10 AM:name=PeterWillemoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PeterWillemoes @ Nov 9 2008, 01:10 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=288275"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->- Do not whistle at sea. It will bring storm and bad accidents to the crew. The only one allowed to whistle, is the boatswain.
- Never start your journey on a friday - Jesus was crucified on a friday!
- Never start your journey on the first monday in april - that day, Cain killed Abel!
- Never start your journey on the second monday in august - that day, Sodoma and Gomorra was destroyed!
- Never start your journey on december 31st - that day, Judas Iskariot hanged himself!

- It is considered a misfortune to have a priest aboard, as well as umbrellas and flowers.
- Women makes the sea angry! On the contrary, a _naked_ woman makes the sea calm and any storm will lie down before her.
(This explains the lot of naked figureheads on ships <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> )
- A black cat aboard is considered to bring luck and bring everyone home. But if a dog is seen near the fishingequipment, it is bad luck!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Sounds like the effing religion to me. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/boom.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":boom" border="0" alt="boom.gif" /> Bulls***! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/boom.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":boom" border="0" alt="boom.gif" />
 
Most likely a belief centred around the word f**k. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />
 
<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />
 
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