• New Horizons on Maelstrom
    Maelstrom New Horizons


    Visit our website www.piratehorizons.com to quickly find download links for the newest versions of our New Horizons mods Beyond New Horizons and Maelstrom New Horizons!

The General Game World Concept

perhaps <a href="http://www.emergent.net/en/Support/Gamebryo-Textbook/" target="_blank">this</a> makes the desicion easier.

these are the RPG´s with that engine:

Fallout 3
Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
Wizard 101
Dungeon Runners
Loki: Heroes of Mythology
Requiem Bloodymare
Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
Dark Age of Camelot Series
Freedom Force

Not the badest and smallest Games.

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Oblivion/Oblivion3_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Loki/Loki_screen1_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Oblivion/Oblivion5_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Dark%20Age%20of%20camelot/DAC_screen1_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Oblivion/Oblivion4_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Oblivion/Oblivion2_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

<img src="http://www.emergent.net/Global/Images/Titles/screenshots/Oblivion/Oblivion1_large.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
 
I think using Gamebryo to develop a custom engine would be awesome, but remember that we would have to purchase a seat for each of our developers. That would mean quite a financial outlay initially. Worthwhile in my view, but still expensive.

I'm actually in the process of getting an evaluation copy of Gamebryo, but it has not yet shown up.

Cap'n Drow
 
I'm quite willing believe it could be done, provided we manage to get enough dedicated and enthusiastic people.
That last part is where the problem lies as far as I'm concerned. Most (read: all) people here do the modding as a hobby and do it on an on/off basis.
If we were to make a game based on the GameBryo engine, we'd have to be professional about it and work to deadlines and make sure the final version is really good.
I'm not so sure if we can manage <i>that</i>. We don't have a very big team; the reason why we manage what we do is because we don't have deadlines and we just keep going. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />
 
You do a great Job with the Old Storm engine and build mod but the engine reach the limit.
Gamers wants fast engine, realistic graphics, tons of options and looks. with storm, impossible.

the same would happen with storm 2.8 when seaward/akella change to GameBryo, in some years 2.8 reachs the limits.
And than??

the community dies. All that awesome ideas, talents are lost.
And i´ve never said "let us make a game and sell it" i said let us make our own game. a game from gamers, for gamers. You done it bevor with build mod. stock PotC is not really a good game, you make it stable, realistc, bigger and, and, and.
 
I'm not saying we shouldn't do it. I'm just wondering if we could. But you're absolutely right that the modding for PotC will probably come to an end at some point.
We've lasted for six years already, but it can't last forever. And it would be most unfortunate to have the community die out when that happens.
So we will need to figure out what to do next. But how do we make "making our own game" realistic?
Seaward.ru has the idea of making a pirate game based on the GameBryo engine. What if we could somehow collaborate?
 
when they ask to collaborate, hey here i´m.
collaborate would be fantastic. they get what they want - a western Pirate game.
We get what we want - a stable Pirate Game thats moddable for many Years.

but they have problems and it looks like "still standing" from there side.
we have a advantage. we´re non commercial. time runs for us.
And every our modders make the mods for himself and not to sell. the quality of our products are now higher than the stock game.
 
I wished we knew how things were standing with Corsairs 4. If Akella doesn't care about it, maybe we can collaborate with seaward.ru anyway to release it as an unofficial game instead?
I don't know how much seaward.ru cares about making money as opposed to making a good pirate game.
 
thats the problem. eddy ask for help but now he says nothing about the project.
And i say it again, he offers the engine, game datas and all the stuff.

let us ask him what he think about it. And they need "Corsairs 5", thats our part <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" />
 
Oh no, this is going to be another essay from me, sorry to put you through this...

This has turned into a debate, I didnt mean to convince anybody to do the right thing, because I dont even know what's the right thing. It wont help to convince Pieter, because he represents everybody, not just himself.

We should not consider ourselves as "the team" in my former post. That is for professionals, we are not fulltime developers!
We should only consider modding a game, <u>based</u> on GameBryo, into PotC:New Horizons! We cant pay for license to a gameengine and should not.

There is so much difference in the two engines, PotC and GameBryo. I know its very easy for anybody to mod GameBryo and other engines. You can build a new character and put him ingame in an hour! You can create a new location with houses, textures and entities for doors, lights, NPC´s and triggers in a couple of days and put it ingame! There will be crashdetection on all objects instantly, no walkpaths needed. But I dont know if it meets our demands regarding freedom in modding. Graphics alone is not good gameplay. How can we code it, does it need object-oriented programming skills like C++? The interface is probably made user-friendly, but in what language - C, javascript or VB ? How is the textures done, is it in just one image or several layers (info on i.e. image, material, surfacereflection and replacement maps)? How will the realistic physics go with ships in the ocean, will we need to put stones in the buttom of every ship to not make it turn around in the waves or can we specify a weight to objects?

We should know more about i.e. GameBryo, but also other engines before we can make such a decision. I am not convinced, that we can put the big size gameworld of PotC into other engines, but perhaps Edward knows how to do this? It may be the case, that we would sail for 100 miles and then it needs to load again, if we build the world up in squares like PotC is made. It loads new scenes seemless (loads while playing) but this can stall any PC and ruin gameplay, if this is done the wrong way!

We should write two letters - one for Edward regarding both CoAS and his "Corsairs 4" project, and one for Emergent Game Technologies, who makes GameBryo with questions around everything.
 
I agree GameBryo looks fantastic, but Cap'n Drow is correct, that would take a major investment to get the rights to use that engine. If you haven't taken a look at it yet, take a look at <a href="http://www.ogre3d.org" target="_blank">Ogre3D</a>, it is open source, and designed to be complied on Windows, Linux and Mac. I don't know a damn thing abut programing, but from what I have seen of this engine, it is quite capable of handling almost anything we could throw at it. It also has a dedicated forum full of people that do understand how to use this engine, and I am sure we could find a few willing to help us out. I am convinced that the only way were are ever going to get the game that we want, is to do it ourselves. You can find some screen shots from games developed using Ogre3D <a href="http://www.ogre3d.org/gallery/" target="_blank">HERE.</a> If we moded an already released game using the GameByro engine, there would be some things we would simply be stuck with. If we built it from scratch using Ogre3D, we would only be limited by what we were able to do ourselves.
 
You´re right @Peter/@Thagarr
Why i choice GameBryo is the opening of all discussion about "Corsairs 4".

please read carefully the first <a href="http://forum.piratesahoy.net//index.php?showtopic=13058" target="_blank">letter</a> from Edward.

they work with GameBryo. They would give us all there stuff to work with it.

I ask me: Why dont we use this offer??
when we colaborate with them, they save money and we can work on mods for the future and we have support from Seaward.ru
Storm engine have no future. Storm is good but who works actually with it?? nobody and so we are back in the jurassic park!

And the best is we dont purchase for anything. its legal for free. Where is the problem?
 
I don't see a problem other than the "can we do it?" question I asked before.
I do see possibilities. Lots of them. But then I see possibilities with CoAS too.
We'll need to discuss with seaward.ru what they're planning and then see if we can collaborate or not.

We've got PLENTY of ideas to make a brilliant game; all we'd need to do is be able to do it and then DO IT.
But of course that is easier said than done. Whatever the case, it's good we're thinking about the future now while we've still got time before Build 14 is done. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/icon_mrgreen1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheeky" border="0" alt="icon_mrgreen1.gif" />
 
Right, Thargaar. Good points. I already posted my questions in their forum <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

EDIT: Legal issues arrgh! We cant just take anything - textures, sound, music, content and transfer it to a free engine, can we???
 
yo ho ho, it would be great if we could build what we wanted with C4, but I don't see Akella, or Seaward giving us that type of free rein with the game. From what we know so far, they seem to have all the main elements set. We are not even sure what the current status of C4 is, it's been a while since we have heard anything from Edward.

Pieter, I think this would be something that we CAN do! We have the talent, and definitely the creativity to pull it off. Our modders are the best in the business! The only thing that we really lack are the programing skills to put it all together seamlessly. We may get lucky and attract new members that do have the skills we currently lack. I know this is something that would take quite a while to accomplish, and it's possible that we just might not be able to hold everything together long enough to pull it off. Even though I really know next to nothing about programming, I am willing to try and learn what I can. That in it's self is liable to take years! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="xD:" border="0" alt="laugh.gif" /> I am in no way trying to distract anyone from working on the build, finishing build 14 should definitely be our top priority! In the meantime though, some of us who are not as involved in the build could try and learn what we can about Ogre3D. I have read a bit, but I am not going to focus all my efforts into it until we decide whether or not that this is something we want to try.

Peter, we might be skirting some legal issues with some things. But that has never stopped us in the past! <img src="http://forum.piratesahoy.net//style_emoticons/default/user_comment.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" /> Also, there is a lot content that is open source and freely available to use in anything, 3D models, textures and skins. There are also freeware alternatives to using Maya and Poser. I know there are some of us that are quite capable of creating some content from scratch as well.

PA is like no other place on the web, we are not all from one country or region, we are truly global in scope. If we could create a pirate game that captured part of that feeling, we would have accomplished something no one has ever tried before. This would definitely be one way to keep things active around here for quite some time to come.
 
Aye, well said Thagarr.

I myself own legal copies of Lightwave and 3DS Max and have student copies of almost every other 3D tool out there.

There is also Blender that we can look at which is both a 3D modeling tool and a game engine in its own right. Which is 100% free!

We have many options for things to use for development, and we definitely have the community to pull off anything we wanted to try. Its just a matter of us buckling down, commiting to do it and getting it done.

Cap'n Drow
 
Here we go folks!

This if one of the many interesting looking free 3D engines I've looked at over the years. It has much potential, just like many of the other engines out there!

<a href="http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/" target="_blank">The Irrlicht Engine</a>

Have a look and let me know what you think!

Cap'n Drow
 
Nice find there Cap'n Drow, I missed that one when I was looking for engines. That does have some great features! There are two things that stand out right off in the features list for Irrlicht :

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Extreme stability. Most libraries for realtime applications crash when the user does something the library programmer did not expect. This is different in the Irrlicht engine. It prints out a warning to (debug-)log and continues, always trying to keep on running.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

That might make it a LOT easier to track down bugs with Irrlicht

And this :
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Two platform and driver independent fast software renderers included. They have different properties (speed vs. quality) and feature everything needed: perspective correct texture mapping, bilinear filtering, sub pixel correctness, z-buffer, gouraud shading, alpha-blending and transparency, fast 2D drawing, and more.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

That should make it more compatible with older computers without a lot of horsepower under the hood!

I also like the license, Ogre3D's license is a bit complicated and requires that you either distribute the source code with the game, or provide a link so it can be downloaded if you use digital distribution.

This one will definitely require some more investigation! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/me.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":onya" border="0" alt="me.gif" />
 
I spend the day reading a lot about game-engines and I found, there is a difference between a game-engine and a game-renderer. Again, another essay. Hope you guys are up to the reading <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad.gif" />

A game-engine like Storm is built up from parts:

1) A game-renderer (probably xinterface.dll right now)
2) Physics-engine (incl. collision detection, think collide.dll does that)
3) Particle system (particles.dll)
4) cinematics
5) Entity handler (what handles locators right now)
6) Sound handler
7) Tools to interact with the above said systems

API (Application Programming Interface) - could be code:blocks and c++ to implement it all.

+Applications to interact between engine and CPU and GPU (i.e. Windows and DirectX) That one should be fairly easy.

A)
We can either choose to put our own engine together ourselves. This will take C++ knowledge and help from outside to implement. It will give us COMPLETE FREEDOM - we can do exactly what we want, anytning is possible. Make the Flying Dutchman fly if you want, jump the rooftops or play as a man-eating shark hehe.
We could take Ogre3D as a render, AGEIA PhysX, FMod for sound, B!NK videoplayer, for tools we could use anything that is also licence-free (UnrealED, Hammer, Terraingenerators etc).

B)
We could grab a free, complete game-engine (like Irrlicht, Source, Unreal3D, CryTek you name them)
We would of course need to put up with already existing limitations, but easy to replace the parts, that are not up to our satisfaction with something better. This also takes skills and C++ knowledge and a lot of work, or we could simply adjust all the included goodies to our needs.

Guys, I already lost my breath. I am worried and scared of all this shit. Yes, we got skills and foremost good spirits! But this will kill us, I am sure.

If we want to make something out of our own, we should look at the parts of the Storm, that is not up to our satisfaction and replace those parts with free alternatives. CoAS already uses fmod, why aren't we? Ogre3D as a renderer to replace those silly russian outdated graphics (lots of support from a large forum community, it handles DX10and ready for DX11 when released next year) or even try to implement new physics via new ragdoll technology like Havoc or PhysX. We would still need to put up with one, single puny Maya 5.0 exporter, buildings with no collision detection, make every single wall and character in Maya, but it is much less work and very realistic, what do you think?
 
Do we have skillfull people here? Certainly. But do we have enough to start on a whole new game? I'm inclined to say "no".
Even with a renderer and even engine already in place, it is a LOT of work indeed.

Would I like us to be able to do it? Certainly. But considering most of us do this modding thing as a hobby outside of totally other stuff in real life,
I've got some doubts on whether this is a realistic goal for us. It'd either take us an incredible amount of time to get something that even appears acceptable,
let alone creating something that is just - plain - good. On the other hand, we could make the game full-time and try to make a living of it.
This would eliminate the "fun" aspect of the whole thing and I, for one, wasn't quite planning on skipping my nautical carreer to create a game. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":?" border="0" alt="unsure.gif" />

So this certainly sounds interesting, but I just can't see us actually realistically managing it. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/dunno.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":shrug" border="0" alt="dunno.gif" />
 
It wont come to that, Pieter - never <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top