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My problems with big cities, such as Santiago, Cartagena and an interesting bug in Turks.

POOTIS

Powder Monkey
Hello!

As you've probably guessed from the title, I would like to talk about big cities and my problem with them. This is all just my personal opinion, so please don't take any offense. I realise that you've all worked really hard to make the game the way it is now, having added so much new and interesting characters, weapons, items, ships, stories, quests and locations, and truly turned this game into something much more enjoyable, which I immensely appreciate. :bow
That being said, let's jump to the main topic of this thread.:bounce

New Granada - Cartagena.
I honestly don't know if the town is supposed to look this way or is it unfinished, but my best guess would be the latter. There are 3 locations of the town which I enjoy and 4 locations which I don't. The 3 locations being the port, the town entrance and the small part of town, left after the entrance. As for the 4 locations I don't enjoy...
The Monastery - The monastery entrance looks unfinished and empty, there are no NPCs and when you enter there's just a square with a few benches, almost looks like a boss arena for a different story (take note that I play mostly on free play)

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The Mansion - Again the mansion area simply looks unfinished, with a very weird design and 0 NPCs. In my opinion it would be better if guards were added - 2 standing in front of the door and several patrolling, as well as a road that leads to the small dock and town and grass. There are several small patches of grass, however they just make everything seem out of place.

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The Palace - On the good side there are NPCs here, however that's the only good side. The area is really empty and the palace texture resolution is really low, I'm guessing it's due to the fact that it's the texture of an indoor skybox (when you look out the window in a home and see buildings). I honestly don't see what's the need of these 3 areas so far.

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The 4th place that I do not like is the big town part, though I will get to it when talking about Santiago. This is a bug I found in Cartagena, at the end of the small town, which doesn't lead anywhere, apart from the deep, dark abyss.

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Cuba - Santiago.
The reason why I don't like the big towns in the game is because they look empty and there is no way of knowing which building is a tavern, store, etc. Even when asking NPCs for directions it's definitely hard to follow (at least for me), I had to go to every single door in Santiago just to find the store at the end of a city in a weird allyway. You might say that a good way to deal with this problem would be to simply fast travel, however that is impossible, unless you find the location first and for me it ruins the immersion. Of course, after a long time of playing I get mildly annoyed after manually walking to a building, still that's not really a problem in smaller towns, such as Port Royale, for example, where the town hall, tavern, shop and shipyard are relatively close to each other. I will now post images of Santiago, showing how empty the city looks and the tavern, and store buildings, which have absolutely no indication that they're a tavern/store.

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This is supposed to be the tavern ^, while there are several other buildings which look exactly the same
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The store at the end of the city ^, no indication of being a store whatsoever, there are around 10 buildings which look IDENTICAL to that one.
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Here you can perfectly see how empty and unreasonalbly big these towns are. ^

But enough complaining.:shrug
I would like to end this topic on something which I found pretty funny and I hope that you'll enjoy as well. Upon entering Turk, if you go directly towards the town hall right after setting foot on the dock, you will see a pirate ship casually sailing through some buildings!

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Talk about an angry ghost ship, am I right? xD

I hope you didn't get offended in any way by this post and once again I would like to thank you for the amazing game you've created, cheers! :cheers
 
Cartagena was added by @Bartolomeu o Portugues originally for the "Bartolomeu o Portugues" storyline. (The similarity in name is not a coincidence, the former wrote the latter.) If you play the storyline, you will find a lot more activity in Cartagena, especially in the mansion and palace courtyard areas.

Santiago, Turks Island and a couple of other places were imported from another game so that all the towns aren't just clones of the few towns from the stock PoTC. You can ask NPC's for directions - if they're hard to follow, perhaps you could write something better, then put it into "PROGRAM\DIALOGS\ENGLISH\Santiago citizen_dialog.h". ;) Or just write the directions, post them here, and I'll put them into the file. In any case, once you have asked an NPC about a location, you can fast-travel there without having to find the place manually.

Ships in port can sometimes be set to move rather than stay still. The system takes no account of the port's layout, so sometimes a ship can end up going through the land. Last time I saw this happen, the ship was trying to sail from Charlestown to Pirate Settlement by taking a short cut through Nevis. xD
 
Well I'll see if I can't come up with better directions, but isn't it possible to put some sort of entity in front of important buildings in large cities such as Santiago? I see how you've added buildings in different towns to make them stand out as well, such as the inaccessible mansion building at the port of Martinique, or the entrance to the town of Speightstown (or Bridgetown, I don't remember). For a shop you could add donkeys and boxes, as seen in the Will Turner treasure hunting quest, in the jungle.
 
The Monastery:
When doing the next quest for the Assassin' storyline, there will be a better Monastery.
See screenshot in this thread: Helping his brother in arms
Unfortunately, I don't know when the quest will be finished:( (without forgetting, I also have to finish a quest for the Bartolomeu' storyline)
The Mansion:
At least, some guards could be there. I thought this thing was done.
The Cartagena Palace:
Yes, the resolution is low. I'm not a good texturer. If somebody could rework that...
Santiago:
Yes, the store could have some boxes in front of... @Jack Rackham , have you got some details that could be added there?
 
Some of those town locations come from Voyage Century Online, which has fairly low detail models in general.
We added them anyway for variety's sake, but they could certainly use some extra detailing.

For the palace, you should've seen that place before I improved the ground texture. It used to be even worse.
I don't think we can make it much better without someone to do some modelling work with Maya. :facepalm
 
I used some time trying to improve the monastary a little, adding a lot of stuff. And that's because I liked the location.
I have used a bunch of quest monks as npc:s here, in WoodesRogers part 2. Maybe they can be used in other storylines as well.
 
Talking of Santiago, I had to search the town centre thoroughly while trying to find the cartographer's house in "A Family Story". While doing so, I found this:
santiago_blacksmith.jpg

That's a smithy! Anyone object to me putting a locator on that door which leads to a blacksmith's shop? Or maybe even have the blacksmith standing outside by the anvil?
 
Doesn't it already look like a blacksmith shop? Maybe enough with the blacksmith?
If you please could upload the locatorfile when you're done with it because I'm working on it too.
 
That's a smithy! Anyone object to me putting a locator on that door which leads to a blacksmith's shop? Or maybe even have the blacksmith standing outside by the anvil?
Sounds like a great idea!
And with that particular layout, having the blacksmith outside might be a good idea too.
Will probably look quite nice. :onya
 
I had to search the town centre thoroughly while trying to find the cartographer's house
Any objections to me trying to
1 add something showing the way outside
2 retexture the inside. I have some (professional) problems with the wooden inside walls of a stonehouse.
 
Any objections to me trying to
1 add something showing the way outside
2 retexture the inside. I have some (professional) problems with the wooden inside walls of a stonehouse.
No objections from my side, at least.

And indeed... wood inside IS a bit odd. Though technically, it could be wood panelling added for an extra nice look.
But in this case, probably not, eh? :rofl
 
When I saw that place I was extremely surprised that there was no blacksmith there, so adding one outside would be a great idea! Though could you also add more NPCs? These big towns look really empty, especially one where the tavern is near gallows (forgot the name), that place has way too few characters, on the other hand the port of Pirate Settlement is sometimes full of NPCs, which I don't understand.
 
Any objections to me trying to
1 add something showing the way outside
2 retexture the inside. I have some (professional) problems with the wooden inside walls of a stonehouse.
1: If it's going to look special, the cartographer's house is going to need to have some function outside this particular quest, preferably for the game in general. Perhaps create a character who sells maps regardless of quest or storyline? Otherwise people are going to see what looks like a special building, try to go in, and wonder what's special about it.
2: Good idea!

Of course, once the blacksmith is operational, the directions in "A Family Quest" can be changed. Just tell the player to go to the house across the road from the blacksmith. :D

Store: definitely an improvement! Once that goes in, I may change the citizen dialog text so that if you ask for directions to the store, they'll mention that there's a pile of stuff outside.

NPC's: I've no idea what governs how many random NPC's will appear at any given location. Of course, there might be the same number of random NPC's in both Havana centre and Nevis pirate settlement, but they're more concentrated in the smaller location. It might also be down to how many locators are in each place; the large towns which were imported from VCO, such as Havana and Santiago, don't have many locators scattered around the streets. For similar reason, it will be difficult to add more permanent citizens without two or more starting off on the same locator.
 
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1 or change to another locatorfile or change the content of an "add" when this quest is started?

This is what I did outside the store:
The barrels to the left is the half of a cut-out .gm model, the other part hidden behind the facade.
The things to the right are cut out from a market stall. They didn't match the other barrels at all in size so I shrinked them with the TOOL.
The cloth over the door is a retextured market tent going through the wall.
The legs had to be tilted 45 to be long enough and to look attached to the wall.
 
NPC's: I've no idea what governs how many random NPC's will appear at any given location. Of course, there might be the same number of random NPC's in both Havana centre and Nevis pirate settlement, but they're more concentrated in the smaller location. It might also be down to how many locators are in each place; the large towns which were imported from VCO, such as Havana and Santiago, don't have many locators scattered around the streets. For similar reason, it will be difficult to add more permanent citizens without two or more starting off on the same locator.
PROGRAM\LandEncounters\LEnc_monsters.c contains the code that places them.
Search for "TOWN_VCSKIP_DISABLEALL" to find where it starts.

Making sure the larger towns have at least an equal number of locators to the smaller ones does seem like a good idea.
Shouldn't be too difficult to do and maybe it'll help.

1 or change to another locatorfile or change the content of an "add" when this quest is started?
That's indeed the easiest. :yes

This is what I did outside the store:
The barrels to the left is the half of a cut-out .gm model, the other part hidden behind the facade.
The things to the right are cut out from a market stall. They didn't match the other barrels at all in size so I shrinked them with the TOOL.
The cloth over the door is a retextured market tent going through the wall.
The legs had to be tilted 45 to be long enough and to look attached to the wall.
And the end result looks like it always belonged that way.
In other words: professionally done! :cheers
 
Meet Micael Salinas, Santiago's new blacksmith and the only blacksmith in the Caribbean with an outdoor smithy:
santiago_blacksmith2.jpg santiago_blacksmith3.jpg santiago_blacksmith4.jpg
His "dialog.c" file is pretty much the same as that for other blacksmiths, but I've written new text for him. Unlike some blacksmith dialogs, this one uses preprocessed place-holders for his name so it can be cloned without change if anyone wants to create another blacksmith but doesn't want to write new text.

The attached file contains the character definition, the dialog files and the revised locator file for Santiago centre. A new game will be needed for the blacksmith to appear.
 

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That looks good. Then I'll continue on that locatorfile or do you have other things to change in there?
 
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