Mod Release Double Running Speed (now realistic 6.6 m/s)

[Tingyun]

@Joer Agreed, on the ocean it is great, on land I can't stand it.

This increased movement speed option is really about bringing POTC in line with other games regarding movement speed, and targeted directly at the players who want that. Anyone used to POTC unique time compression system is going to think there's no point, because they no longer notice how odd it feels to some of us, especially new players like me.

 

[Joer]

It's a very 'gamey' feature in a game that I don't want to feel that way. It's a shame that the original PotC never had a fatigue system like modern RPGs to handle the sprinting and running system.

 

[Tingyun]

Yep, time acceleration on land always draws me out of roleplaying as well, agreed on it feeling too gamey, makes the world feel not real.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Indeed time compression is definitely weird and I don't mind if it can be avoided.
I had to add silly code to the game to drop out of time compression in case enemies are near to avoid you suddenly getting killed in fast forward mode.

 

[Jack Rackham]

@Jack Rackham couldn't we just increase the speed the mocassins go at? Shouldn't be hard to edit.

No, but the moccasin speed still has to look good.

 

[Jack Rackham]

Indeed time compression is definitely weird and I don't mind if it can be avoided.

Yes but again it's very useful for gametesting. I start maybe up to 2o new games per day. It's quick in to check things and quick out again. I can't do without it.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

No, but the moccasin speed still has to look good.

Very true. Then how about somebody tries to find the maximum speed that still looks good, then the "regular" running speed can be, say, half that.

Yes but again it's very useful for gametesting. I start maybe up to 2o new games per day. It's quick in to check things and quick out again. I can't do without it.

Absolutely!

Note that I said "can be avoided". With that, I meant that I would not mind if it is not quite necessary to use it during regular play.
The option will remain available, of course. I said nothing to suggest that we should take it out altogether.

 

[Grey Roger]

Considering that walking is so slow, I always run everywhere. Usually with time compression.
This makes walking basically useless. Is there abutting anything that walking COULD be good for?

I often do that when I need to cover a lot of distance, e.g. the whole way across a jungle section where there are no bandits in the way, or from Santiago port gate to the store. Walking is more useful when I'm going a short distance, e.g. from Kralendijk shipyard to store.

And that's why I still say the current run speed is correct. Often it's not a sprint. 4 minute mile speed might be realistic for a 20th century person on good terrain in athlete's vest and shorts over a short distance. I can guarantee that Nathaniel Hawk would not manage that speed carrying a normal set of equipment from one end of Havana to the other, even if his life depended on it because the Spanish army was chasing him.

My main concern here is if the speed doesn't match the animation, the player character will appear to slide over the ground.
I wouldn't want that to be the case.

And on that note, try visiting Cayman port or Havana town centre some time. There is one female citizen in each who does exactly that.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

And that's why I still say the current run speed is correct. Often it's not a sprint. 4 minute mile speed might be realistic for a 20th century person on good terrain in athlete's vest and shorts over a short distance. I can guarantee that Nathaniel Hawk would not manage that speed carrying a normal set of equipment from one end of Havana to the other, even if his life depended on it because the Spanish army was chasing him.

You can probably argue over what is "realistic" until the end of all time.

Another relevant question though is "what makes good gameplay". I personally use time compression while travelling ashore pretty much ALL the time.
That does strongly suggest the running speed is lower than I might like, since if running is faster, then there is less need to use it. Right?

And on that note, try visiting Cayman port or Havana town centre some time. There is one female citizen in each who does exactly that.

What character model is that?

 

[Grey Roger]

The one in Cayman is "Fanielle", I believe - looking at "PROGRAM\Characters\init\cayman.c", she may be Ginny Weasly, though the character ID is "Gillian Atterbury". (Renamed by a Harry Potter fan, presumably. ) The one in Havana is "Caroline_K", character name Narcisa Montse.

I tend to use time compression for really long runs. For shorter charges, e.g. towards a group of bandits part way across a jungle scene, normal run at normal time is sufficient.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

The one in Cayman is "Fanielle", I believe - looking at "PROGRAM\Characters\init\cayman.c", she may be Ginny Weasly, though the character ID is "Gillian Atterbury". (Renamed by a Harry Potter fan, presumably. ) The one in Havana is "Caroline_K", character name Narcisa Montse.

Is Fanielle not just a retexture of the regular Danielle character model?
Or is that one that High Sea Lass modified and reanimated and such?

 

[Grey Roger]

That's odd. Fanielle does look like just a retextured Danielle, but she has a separate head. I've no idea who created that model as there is no comment in "initModels.c" claiming credit.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Must indeed be a TOOL experiment by someone then.

 

[Tingyun]

Gameplay is indeed the central issue. I cannot stress this enough--for players used to the faster speeds in other games, the running speed in this game makes it very boring to go anywhere. It is a significant detterent to new players becoming involved with this game, and was signfiicantly harming my enjoyment even after I had played for many many hours.

I honestly can see no reason not to offer this as an option, and one thst features prominently so that new players will know it is there (ie, not buried in internal settings where new players will get frustated long before they find it).

And while we should work to help the quest item preserve usefulness, one item in one quest should really not bar an optional feature that is critical to the enjoyment of the game for a class of players across all storylines. Slowing down players who would choose to set their speed faster on all storylines so that if they play one they can find an item more fun just can't be the right choice. If it comes down to it, the running speed option could always go to default in that storyline, so that the moccasins retain their special nature there, while players in other storylines could still select the faster speed.

As for realism, @Grey Roger here is my response when Skyworm made the same point:
The current running speed could indeed make sense, depends on how you coneptualize it:
- Current running speed is a marathon (26 mile) running pace. A bit unrealistic (as Joer notes) to run around town at all, but if you were doing so, it is the right speed. Very unrealistic in combat, when someone is potentially shooting at you or you need to run away.
- Speed of this mod 2x is a sprinting speed. Realistic for combat. More unrealistic if running around town, but that was already unrealistic anyway, and seems a nod to player gameplay choice over realism.
- Some intermediate speed (1.5x or therabout) would be more of a mile+ pace. Not really realistic in either combat or running around town, but a little more fitting for each.

To summarize, current running speeds render the land elements of the game boring and tedious for players used to the much faster speeds in other games. This is the sort of option that experienced players might not care about and go with the default, but is critical to some subset of new players being able to enjoy the game.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

So if we want the mocassins to retain their purpose, what is the maximum speed that still look OK in the game?
My suggestion: Use that for the special quest item and use something lower for regular play that is still higher than it is now.
Possible?

 

[Tingyun]

Especially if it were due to a special magic item, running looks fine faster than the current 6.6 m/s. The moccasins could drive it up to 8.0 m/s no problem, probably even higher (I just know 8.0 is the fastest I tested in game, and it looked fine).

Remember that running is about gliding, if your feet aren't gliding in the air as you run, and instead one foot is always in contact with the ground, then you are walking.

6.6 m/s wasn't the maximum amount thst looks good by any stretch, it was just about bringing it in line with other games, like morrowind. Higher speeds, like 8.0 or higher, would be sort of like playing morrowind with a character that has magic boots enchanted for speed, which is probably the desired effect anyway. Assuming the mocassins are intended to give the effect of being magically fast, rather than simply locking preferred gameplay speed behind an item with limited storyline availability (which wouldn't make sense).

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Remember that running is about gliding, if your feet aren't gliding in the air as you run, and instead one foot is always in contact with the ground, then you are walking.

I.... don't think it quite work like that. Pretty sure that whenever I run, I do have the tip of my foot firmly on the ground without gliding over the floor.
Good thing too; otherwise I'd fall right on my face.

Assuming the mocassins are intended to give the effect of being magically fast, rather than simply locking preferred gameplay speed behind an item with limited storyline availability (which wouldn't make sense).

It indeed has a very specific storyline use.

 

[Tingyun]

@Pieter Boelen Here is what I mean, from wikipedia:

"Running is a type of gait characterized by an aerial phase in which all feet are above the ground (though there are exceptions[1]). This is in contrast to walking, where one foot is always in contact with the ground,"

I am using "gliding" to refer to the aerial phase, which is why run animations looks great even at high speed, but turning up the speed of walking animations too much makes it looks wrong.

If you mean the moment in a run where a foot makes contact with the ground briefly before again entering the aerial phase, sure, and I imagine if you really stared exactly at that point or the foot during the run animation, then anything over 3.3m/s might see some slight improper movement. But you'd have to really stare at thst point, and anyone playing normally would percieve the genral gliding as simply the aerial phase of running, which characterizes running.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I did indeed mean that when you run, you don't actually glide on the ground.
But sure, you are indeed "flying through the air" for a bit.

 

[Tingyun]

Then we are on the same page, my point is that in playing with the faster speeds, any gliding simply looks like the natural result of the aerial phase, and you'd have to really look for problems to find it odd.

In contrast to the walk animations, which quickly begin to look wrong when sped up, because of the lack of the aerial phase.