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WIP Soleil Royal

Armada

Sea Dog
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Project Manager
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Storm Modder
Mates, I have some monumental news! :dance
I have only just made a very important discovery, regarding the camera glitch (the unusually highly centred 3rd person camera) which has plagued this ship and several others so mysteriously.
What I've found suggests, with strong evidence to support it, that the camera glitch is related to the individual models themselves. In almost all cases, it's actually down to flagpoles!

Flagpoles which are an integrated part of the hull (the root model), and not separate models themselves, significantly increase the overall height of said root model.
This, in turn, causes the camera to try and centre in the absolute middle of the hull, and zoom out even further, which it therefore cannot do when fully zoomed out at sea, because the lower portion of the view would be underwater.
Therefore, the camera as to sit on top of the waterline, which moves it up from the centre of the hull model. That is what makes it look weird.

So the lesson to learn from this (modellers, take note!), is NOT to integrate flagpoles, or other tall objects, as part of the hull model!

Anyway, onto the Soleil Royal herself.
She was deemed broken beyond repair before she was dropped from the Build Mod, because TOOL won't read the hull, and it fails to convert correctly to Maya-compatible OBJ format.
TOOL and Maya are the only lifelines a ship model normally has, and this one had used them both up.
Still, I've come up with what I consider to be a breakthrough workaround for this problem- so far, with no adverse effects!

Essentially, the problem lies in the root model being too tall. The solution? Use a different root model.
This requires a close match in size and shape (I chose the San Felipe- this is to match the collision detection), to act as the new main hull, except the entire thing is then textured as an alpha map.
Then, all its old locators are removed, except for one, which is changed to make the Soleil Royal's hull model appear at (0,0).
So effectively, the root model is completely invisible, and the ship acts as it normally would in-game, without the player ever noticing! :wp

So far, tests have shown that it works flawlessly. The waterline is the same, the bow waves are (almost) perfect... and of course, the camera centres correctly! :woot
Plus, we have a new root model to play with, which means we can fix any locators related to the hull using TOOL. Another bonus for this workaround.
Now, it's only a matter of time until we can finish the rigging (I believe it was never completed?) and get the ship back to her rightful spot as the biggest, most powerful ship in the game!

Here's a screenshot to remind you of how great this model was, and still is:

SoleilRoyal_return.jpg

P.S. Huzzah for the forum being back online! Just in time, too. :cheers
 
Well you have certainly been busy! :bow

You have discovered two big fixes. I've been hearing about the Soliel Royal but don't believe I have ever seen her before. Good job!

Does finding that the integrated flagpole is the culprit mean that ships with it can be easily repaired? Would turning the flagpole invisible work or does it need to be removed? Either way, this is a big breakthrough. Maybe some day soon I can once again sail one of the East Indiaman variants.
 
Nice find on the flagpoles mate, well done! Good to see the Soleil Royal back in game, she is a real beauty! :cheers
 
Just you wait till you do see her! Quite a ship to behold, this one- with a very high poly count! :shock

For repairing other ships with the same problem, it simply depends on the ship.
Newer ones, like pgargon's Apostol Felipe or La Couronne, should be easier to fix, because the flagpole (and a chunk of other parts with it) can be separated from the main model using TOOL.
For others, they might need a similar workaround to the Soleil Royal, and have a different model act as the main hull.

Simply making the flagpole invisible doesn't change anything.
A while ago, before I even knew the flagpole was the culprit, I alpha-mapped the pole on RN_Warship's stern, so that a bigger spanker could be fitted correctly.
The ship's camera was still slightly higher than usual, even with the flagpole removed from view.

What's this about East Indiaman variants? I don't sail them often, so I haven't seen the problem. :?
 
Yeah, I noticed it first on the Jamaicaship1 and started a thread about it. The Mordaunt and all versions of the East Indiaman are also affected. This includes the wargalleons.
 
Ah, those ships. Yes, their flagpoles are pretty tall, too.
You should be able to fix it, by:
  1. Copying the hull model and renaming it to '[Shipname]_part1.gm' (plus another back-up copy, just in case)
  2. Using 'Edit Scene' in TOOL to delete the part with the flagpole on the main model, and delete all BUT the flagpole part on 'part1'
  3. Adding a locator at (0,0,0) to the hull model, named 'part1', in the 'geometry' group, and removing ALL locators from the 'part1' model.
Those three steps should fix the problem, but obviously, the model must be readable in TOOL.
If not, then we have to use the other workaround, which isn't preferable, but it works.
 
I've spent some time playing around in TOOL and......methinks I'll just stick to adding ropes and playing with sails. :wp
 
Fair enough. I just thought it would be better for you to give it a go, because I certainly can't fit those ships in with everything else at the moment. :wacko:
I might get round to it eventually, in that case.
 
Just out of interest... which Build version was the Soleil Royal first introduced into? :?
I'm asking because I've read in some threads that the ship actually was edited in TOOL before, although unsuccessfully, whereas TOOL won't even load the model now.
If there was an earlier version, would that be the editable one? If the ship could be edited, then it might be possible to split it into two parts using 'Edit scene'.
This would hopefully mean that a conversion to OBJ format would work successfully, and if the two halves were converted, she could be edited in Maya.

Of course, this would all depend on whether TOOL would have one of its tantrums when splitting the ship up... :facepalm
 
Not sure if we can ever fix her, but I believe I had somewhere a raw model of Soleil for 3ds max. It needed a lot of fixing done before it could be game worthy and I never atempted to do that
unsure.gif


Also wasn't the first version of her made for CoAS?
 
Well that's just it, I don't know when she was first put into a mod. I wasn't here when they did it. :shrug

If there really isn't a TOOL editable version, then I you could always upload the raw model to the FTP. Then, it's there for any modeller to work on.
 
The SoleilRoyal was adapted properly for CoAS, yes. The main issue was the slight adaptation required for PotC.
If I recall, being able to open the file or not depends on the computer; Thomas the Terror managed at one point and tried to do the locator work.
However, that somehow made almost all the hull of the ship disappear. NOT good.
 
aside from the ship, that vector bugfix seems pretty darn important to me too, actually. i'd never read about that before.
 
When I tried to open it in TOOL the hull was a complete mess - there's just too much polys
That's why it needs to be split into two or more separate models, and put back together with locators.
That way, the individual parts could be exported to Maya, put back together, fixed, then split up and re-exported again.
 
aside from the ship, that vector bugfix seems pretty darn important to me too, actually. i'd never read about that before.

Agreed! Overall it is far more important to fix the dozen or so affected ships than one ship that will be never seen anyway.
 
i'm having the impression that the modders rather tackle the smaller of the two problems first though. ^_^ which i can't really blame them for.
 
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