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"sail to" with companions

Unlucky Jack

Landlubber
I've noticed that if I use "sail to" that my companions ships end up right on top of me almost, especially if I use it to get to an enemy ship. It almost always results in a collision and fleet positions seem to have no bearing on the end result..
Any idea if I can fix this so that the game doesn't continue to try to log all ships on the same spot?
 
Can anyone confirm this? As far as I remember, when doing a sail-to with companions, they'd all still be in line. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wacko.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":wacko:" border="0" alt="wacko.gif" />
 
I check that out, I think it happen a few time for me.




<b>Cheers,</b> <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/par-ty.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":cheers" border="0" alt="par-ty.gif" />
 
in my case they always get left behind. only i move to the new spot. when the hour changes they're back with me.
 
<!--quoteo(post=253763:date=Apr 28 2008, 05:03 PM:name=Morgan Terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Morgan Terror @ Apr 28 2008, 05:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=253763"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->in my case they always get left behind. only i move to the new spot. when the hour changes they're back with me.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Same thing for me actually
 
Hmm, very strange because I seem to remember this happening always, not just on this install. The only time that my companion ships do not jump with me is if I have ordered them to sail away and they are BVR or if I have ordered them to heave to drift. Never ever are they lined up. Um' but then I rarely use sail to at the beginning of a battle so they are usually dispersed. If I have ordered them to attack other ships, they "sail to" with me and then set course back to their targets. Usually the only major damage I take in battle is from collisions with my own ships after using "sail to" (usually as my bowchaser mast gets sheared off) so you can see how this would be frustrating.
But if you folks are experiencing something different, then perhaps its the ghost in my machine messing with me. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/type_1.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":nk" border="0" alt="type_1.gif" />
 
well, I have now been playing a fresh install with 13 final applied and the results are identical. Even companions tasked to attack and are far away get sucked into the vortex that is "Sail to" and then they usually blast me trying to blast the enemy or simply try to crush me as they attempt to correct their course back to their task. Most of these ships shouldn't even be able to "sail to" with me because they are usually slow behemoths loaded with the spoils of war like a battleship or a MOW and according to the settings they shouldn't have the speed to catch up. Now I don't usually use sail to until I'm chasing down the last straggler. I also noticed on the previouse install that "instant boarding" wasn't very successful even against disabled lower class ships. maybe that had something to do with it.
 
can anyone confirm if what i am experiencing has something to do with the directsail mod?
 
<!--quoteo(post=253786:date=Apr 29 2008, 05:43 AM:name=a simple virtual sailor)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (a simple virtual sailor @ Apr 29 2008, 05:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=253786"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=253763:date=Apr 28 2008, 05:03 PM:name=Morgan Terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Morgan Terror @ Apr 28 2008, 05:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=253763"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->in my case they always get left behind. only i move to the new spot. when the hour changes they're back with me.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Same thing for me actually
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Huh? At the top of the hour they magically appear with you? I'm not sure I understand what you are saying here.
 
<!--quoteo(post=255705:date=May 8 2008, 06:00 PM:name=a simple virtual sailor)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (a simple virtual sailor @ May 8 2008, 06:00 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=255705"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's because of the DirectSail mod.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

Which I'm not using.

<!--quoteo(post=255711:date=May 8 2008, 07:09 PM:name=Morgan Terror)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Morgan Terror @ May 8 2008, 07:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=255711"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->indeed. hour changes indicate a change in the weather and often new encounters.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I get the weather changes but not encounters.
 
The DirectSail mod is not in Build 13 Final. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/no.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":no" border="0" alt="no.gif" />
 
Yes, you can. I'm just explaining why Unlucky Jack doesn't have the encounters. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/doff.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":doff" border="0" alt="doff.gif" />
 
Ok, if Direct sail is not part of 13 final then we can safely assume it has no responsibility or bearing on this topic. So the question remains - why does this happen? Why would "sail to" take ships that all heading on the same bearing and have them arrive on different bearings and well inside the minimum location teleport distance apart? When they spawn at the destination they are usually already in collision with each other if there are 4 of us but if they are ordered to heave to drift, they do not "sail to".
Here's what I think is happening- I think that "sail to" is the same bit of kit that gives us the ability to "fast travel" between destinations on land. which means that there is a scalar somewhere that defines where the ships are generated and how close they are to the intended spawn on sea the same as on land. The problem becomes amplified when there larger ships involved, such as battleships and MOWs. I suspect this is because the Ships have overly large " collision zones around them. Try coming along side a mow with any ship and you realize that collision begins at about 50 yards. Do the same with sloops and the distance is much smaller. So if you have 4 large ships ( bigger than corvette) the space in which they have to " arrive " is just too small to support them and doesn't have anyway to adjust. So it just trys to fit them in anyway it can. Imagine a box drawn around the "destination" that has a specific size. If there isnt any way to expand the box then everything just gets crammed into the box. Not a problem if the ships are small, but a huge problem with big ships. Like having 3 parking spaces and 4 cars, it can be done but there's gonna be some scraped paint and broken mirrors.
What I can't figure out though is why "sail to" would bring all the party's ships to the location if they have already been tasked, and why the heave to task prevents them. Ships that have been ordered to "sail away" will not be included in the "sail to" if they are beyond visual range(BVR) USUALLY, although I have had it happen that they occasionally rejoin the group for a hug. Not really a big deal unless I ordered them to sail away because they were on the verge of sinking, in which case a collision is usually enough to sink them.
There must be an instruction with in the "sail to" function code that tells it to move the entire group, just like on land. Perhaps when I tell the ship to "heave to" its like ordering a companion on land to " stay here" which I've never done but I assume it would stop that NPC to stay put while the rest of the group "fast travels".
Another interesting observation using "sail to" is that should I use "sail to" on a surrendered ship, the distance that I respawn at is larger than if the destination is active, provided I have no other ships in the group. I confirmed this when I had a lot of surrendered quarry( big battle). I used "sail to" whith all companion ships ordered to "heave to". On each successive "sail to" I ordered 1 ship to "defend' me. By my 3rd "sail to" ( now a 3 ship group) I practically spawned right next to the quarry and it was a scramble to get out of each others way. I think the next experiment will consist of me buying 4 puny gunboats and "sail to" a friendly ship. I expect that there will be no collisions even at full sail.
 
I think one of our coders should look into this. Unfortunately there's only one that's actually active now: Pirate_KK. I'll send him a PM.
 
The code which decides about ship location after SailTo is in PROGRAM\SEA_AI\AISea.c in three procedures: void SeaAI_SailToEndFade();, void SeaAI_SailToLocator(string sLocName); and void SeaAI_SailToCharacter(int iCharacterIndex);. Unfortunately, after first insight into this code I guess that only one location is set there (maybe for player's flagship, or is it some "averaged" location?) and rest of ships, as well as their behaviour depending of orders they have is handled by engine itself. Thus, I suspect that changing locations of separate ships would require total rewriting of that code.

BTW: did you noticed that although there is couple of commands player can give to his "fleet" the only whose are actually implemented are "drift" (when simply mean to strike all sails) and "sail away" (after which ship sails randomly around). Task "Attack" is implemented (but its quality isn't "top"), while "Defend" and "Abordage" isn't implemented at all! I checked AoP code, but Akella didn't change anything there. After finishing this Alpha I plan to code it somehow.

pirate_kk
 
I have never tried using the abordage command, but I have used defend. I think it is misnamed, because it does seem to work to recall ships that you have sent to attack or ordered to heave to and drift. I use it when one of my fleet has gotten too far away in pursuit of a fleeing ship. It should probably be named "Recall" rather than defend, although I suppose once they get back in range they will start firing on active opponents. Speaking of fleeing ships, what determines whether a ship will fight, flee or surrender? Is it possible to set a particular ship to always flee? I'm trying my hand at coding a quest, and I would like to have one ship immediately flee when encountered so it has to be chased down.
 
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