Guys:
I've been out of the loop over here for a bit ... got tied up with another modding project.
However, as it looks like action might be picking up again, with the fresh contact with the Russians and all, I figured I would throw out my list of notions and see what kind of reaction they get. This was all basically stuff I was pushing for earlier, but here's a more coherent list:
1. Real time and distance. There seems to be a huge gap in the wooden ship games between real time simulation and RPG-type stuff with generally greatly increased time scale for a more action-arcade feel. (The simulation games generally offer accelerated time of some sort - we can take that as far as necessary.) We made a number of moves earlier to narrow this gap - more realistic reload times, and the like. The one part of this that has not kept up is the "sail-to" command and the range of combat. Most of the strategy of a sailing ship encounter came from setting up the enemy at rather extreme range ... by the time the ships were within firing range, they had been maneuvering each other into position sometimes for hours (or days). I move for the sail-to and map commands be disabled or at least greatly modified when a potentially hostile ship is nearby, and that ships drop out of map mode as soon as the opposing ships would be visible. It will slow the game down a little, but it will add a LOT of realistic tactics ... and if it's too slow, there's always accelerated time.
2. Real problems with fire. Fire was (and still is) the greatest danger on a military ship. Fire does not, however, immediately attack the hull and cause the ship to sink. Fire spreads relatively slowly, and creates the greatest danger to men, rigging, guns and supplies - it is not really a danger to the hull unless the ship burns to the waterline. It also does not just go out because of a "fire drill" - it will cause confusion and inefficiency among the crew for some time (while everybody stops what they're doing so they can fight fire). Sometimes it can be controlled, sometimes it spreads (depending on the crew number and skill) ... either way, it takes some time to do one or the other, during which time the condition of the ship is somewhat in question.
2b. On that note, water leakage is much the same. The more water a ship is taking, the more crewmen have to stop fighting and start bailing water. The water itself does not really do any damage immediately (unless it continues until the ship actually goes down, which will likely take a while), but it forces the crew to take immediate action that does not include shooting back at you.
3. More realistic economics. Swords may be expensive, but they're nothing compared to the cost of an entire ship. The greatly inflated ship sizes and numbers (like pirates operating a fleet of battleships) was in part a response to the economic imbalances associated with this. Cost of ship crew, also, is a little off ... only the officers seem to cost anything. Ships should be expensive to maintain as well, much more so for the larger ones.
4. Greater variation in personal weapons. Instead of a continuous gradation from "worse" to "better", a set of variations to reflect the unique properties of certain weapons. For example, heavy blades do a LOT more damage, but they are slower, and harder to use in an effective block. Rapiers and smallswords are easy to use and quick, but you would have to jab somebody 15 times with one to really get his attention. That sort of variation would open up a lot more tactics options as well as reducing the effect of players getting the "best" weapon and having nothing else to gain.
5. Crew wounded as opposed to killed. Not everyone disabled in combat would die of those wounds ... some would, but many would be temporarily disabled by wounds that were not medically serious. This would make the role of a good doctor much more significant. It would also add a certain degree of "down-time" between combat sequences, while your wounded crewmen were getting patched up before they would be ready to fight again.
6. Transport of people. Max useful crew on a ship is one thing, but if you need replacements, marines for a boarding operation, or colonists/troops for a fort you took over, you need to be able to pack the storage areas with extra crew/troops/whoever. This needs an over-max-crew function ... where the extras still eat, and/or can be moved up to replace casualties as needed, but do not affect the ship's efficiency if over the max rated number.
6b. Likewise, the ability to convert crew space to storage could be useful for merchantmen running light crew to cut cost ... no reason they can't pile the extra crew space full of barrels. Maybe the way to do that is to convert crewmen into cargo weight, and add the necessary weight to each ship to account for their normal crew.
7. Eventually, it would be nice to see zone damage. The masts and guns that can be damaged/destroyed are a major step in the right direction, but an even more complex damage model has potential, especially when it comes to calculating things like the ship taking water, cargo being damaged/destroyed, crew casualties, and such. The whole "hull hit point" thing is fine for calculating repair costs, but it doesn't really cover complex problems like taking water, fire on the gun deck, or the food supply getting hit. But that's probably beyond the scope of immediate projects, and is more just something to think about for now.
8. Independent allies. I hear build 14 alpha 8 has a capture colony option where you can put your people in charge. Another good thing to go with this is the ability to send ships somewhere on the map ... send a captured ship back to a nearby port, and pick them up later, or order one of your officers to take a ship and run a trade route for you. This will get a lot more critical if you can own colonies, as you may have to own the merchant fleet that supplies them as well.
9. Ship-to-ship small-arms fire. Just because they can't get any cannon to bear on you, does not mean you wouldn't get pelted from musket fire, swivel guns, flaming arrows into your sails, or if you get really close, hand grenades (those big black bombs). The rather arbitrary value at the beginning of the boarding sequence seems a cheap work-around ... a way to make opposing crews sling lead at each other randomly every chance they get should be on the list of things to think about.
That's just the stuff I was working through before. Haven't been able to get 14 alpha 8 to download yet, so if any of this has been added recently, do point it out. Otherwise, comments? Thoughts? Am I crazy?
I'm not much of a programmer, so I sort of have to just throw out the ideas and let other people actually write it.
I've been out of the loop over here for a bit ... got tied up with another modding project.
However, as it looks like action might be picking up again, with the fresh contact with the Russians and all, I figured I would throw out my list of notions and see what kind of reaction they get. This was all basically stuff I was pushing for earlier, but here's a more coherent list:
1. Real time and distance. There seems to be a huge gap in the wooden ship games between real time simulation and RPG-type stuff with generally greatly increased time scale for a more action-arcade feel. (The simulation games generally offer accelerated time of some sort - we can take that as far as necessary.) We made a number of moves earlier to narrow this gap - more realistic reload times, and the like. The one part of this that has not kept up is the "sail-to" command and the range of combat. Most of the strategy of a sailing ship encounter came from setting up the enemy at rather extreme range ... by the time the ships were within firing range, they had been maneuvering each other into position sometimes for hours (or days). I move for the sail-to and map commands be disabled or at least greatly modified when a potentially hostile ship is nearby, and that ships drop out of map mode as soon as the opposing ships would be visible. It will slow the game down a little, but it will add a LOT of realistic tactics ... and if it's too slow, there's always accelerated time.
2. Real problems with fire. Fire was (and still is) the greatest danger on a military ship. Fire does not, however, immediately attack the hull and cause the ship to sink. Fire spreads relatively slowly, and creates the greatest danger to men, rigging, guns and supplies - it is not really a danger to the hull unless the ship burns to the waterline. It also does not just go out because of a "fire drill" - it will cause confusion and inefficiency among the crew for some time (while everybody stops what they're doing so they can fight fire). Sometimes it can be controlled, sometimes it spreads (depending on the crew number and skill) ... either way, it takes some time to do one or the other, during which time the condition of the ship is somewhat in question.
2b. On that note, water leakage is much the same. The more water a ship is taking, the more crewmen have to stop fighting and start bailing water. The water itself does not really do any damage immediately (unless it continues until the ship actually goes down, which will likely take a while), but it forces the crew to take immediate action that does not include shooting back at you.
3. More realistic economics. Swords may be expensive, but they're nothing compared to the cost of an entire ship. The greatly inflated ship sizes and numbers (like pirates operating a fleet of battleships) was in part a response to the economic imbalances associated with this. Cost of ship crew, also, is a little off ... only the officers seem to cost anything. Ships should be expensive to maintain as well, much more so for the larger ones.
4. Greater variation in personal weapons. Instead of a continuous gradation from "worse" to "better", a set of variations to reflect the unique properties of certain weapons. For example, heavy blades do a LOT more damage, but they are slower, and harder to use in an effective block. Rapiers and smallswords are easy to use and quick, but you would have to jab somebody 15 times with one to really get his attention. That sort of variation would open up a lot more tactics options as well as reducing the effect of players getting the "best" weapon and having nothing else to gain.
5. Crew wounded as opposed to killed. Not everyone disabled in combat would die of those wounds ... some would, but many would be temporarily disabled by wounds that were not medically serious. This would make the role of a good doctor much more significant. It would also add a certain degree of "down-time" between combat sequences, while your wounded crewmen were getting patched up before they would be ready to fight again.
6. Transport of people. Max useful crew on a ship is one thing, but if you need replacements, marines for a boarding operation, or colonists/troops for a fort you took over, you need to be able to pack the storage areas with extra crew/troops/whoever. This needs an over-max-crew function ... where the extras still eat, and/or can be moved up to replace casualties as needed, but do not affect the ship's efficiency if over the max rated number.
6b. Likewise, the ability to convert crew space to storage could be useful for merchantmen running light crew to cut cost ... no reason they can't pile the extra crew space full of barrels. Maybe the way to do that is to convert crewmen into cargo weight, and add the necessary weight to each ship to account for their normal crew.
7. Eventually, it would be nice to see zone damage. The masts and guns that can be damaged/destroyed are a major step in the right direction, but an even more complex damage model has potential, especially when it comes to calculating things like the ship taking water, cargo being damaged/destroyed, crew casualties, and such. The whole "hull hit point" thing is fine for calculating repair costs, but it doesn't really cover complex problems like taking water, fire on the gun deck, or the food supply getting hit. But that's probably beyond the scope of immediate projects, and is more just something to think about for now.
8. Independent allies. I hear build 14 alpha 8 has a capture colony option where you can put your people in charge. Another good thing to go with this is the ability to send ships somewhere on the map ... send a captured ship back to a nearby port, and pick them up later, or order one of your officers to take a ship and run a trade route for you. This will get a lot more critical if you can own colonies, as you may have to own the merchant fleet that supplies them as well.
9. Ship-to-ship small-arms fire. Just because they can't get any cannon to bear on you, does not mean you wouldn't get pelted from musket fire, swivel guns, flaming arrows into your sails, or if you get really close, hand grenades (those big black bombs). The rather arbitrary value at the beginning of the boarding sequence seems a cheap work-around ... a way to make opposing crews sling lead at each other randomly every chance they get should be on the list of things to think about.
That's just the stuff I was working through before. Haven't been able to get 14 alpha 8 to download yet, so if any of this has been added recently, do point it out. Otherwise, comments? Thoughts? Am I crazy?
I'm not much of a programmer, so I sort of have to just throw out the ideas and let other people actually write it.
" border="0" alt="dunno.gif" /> as for the setting up before battle, do you have any idea how long waiting for a few hours in the game is? of course, you can speed up, but you still have to wait for a long time. the worldmap is currently used for setting up your ships in a good position. you can determine the distance and position relative to that of the enemy yourself. i've often started a battle where the enemy would be really far away, giving me plenty of time to take care of my angle of approach.
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