Why the hype??

[StevenSSX]

I'm playing PotC Build 14 Beta 1 and I'm just wondering why everyone thinks this is the best version of Akella's pirate games? So far there has only been a few things I like and a bunch I don't like compared to Age of Pirates/Age of Pirates 2...

I played about 10 minutes with Jack Sparrow and another 10 with Horatio Hornblower...
-the music is great
-the storyline so far is pretty good on both characters
-direct sail
-the amount of options (money & rank selection, paint colours, etc.)

What I didn't like:
-you can't look around the character (by pressing CTRL)
-outdated graphics
-unnecessarily large icons and interface buttons
-sidestepping is messed up
-ship particles outdated
-you can't quickly go to places in town through a menu
-overall doesn't feel as polished as AoP

:/ are these common issues, or am I the only one who cares?

 

[Captain Maggee]

Well it is a mod for a game that was released in 2003 so the graphics are going to be a bit outdated.

Pressing enter allows you to fast travel (make sure you turn off realistic settings if you want to be able to do this from start, otherwise you need to find the place before you can fast travel)

Sidestepping is a known issue (look at the Build and forum FAQ for other commonly asked questions)

We get more complaints about the texts and stuff being to small, not so much large

 

[StevenSSX]

I'll be playing AoP until a new graphics mod is soon released for AoP2. Then I hope some of this stuff gets ported over. Anyways, I like what you guys have done but I'm more into graphics and simplicity.

 

[simwake26]

StevenSSX,

The reason for the hype is the fact that people who truely care about this project have put 1000's of hours of work into this, to turn what was in all honesty a pretty mediocre game when it was released, into something people are still playing day in day out seven years later.

I agree that nice graphics are good, but they get boring quickly without the gameplay value to back them up, and that is what this mod is all about, improving the gameplay. All the aspects which you have listed as being good have been added by the mod comunity.

The modders on this site have all put their own free time into this mod with no payback other than improving it for everyone else, please remember that.

 

[superdurnius]

I'm playing PotC Build 14 Beta 1 and I'm just wondering why everyone thinks this is the best version of Akella's pirate games? So far there has only been a few things I like and a bunch I don't like compared to Age of Pirates/Age of Pirates 2...

And I can say only one think, in graphic aspect, only difference in AoP and AoP2 is sea graphics and island models... everything else is already ported to PotC... If you had played Build Mod MORE THAN 10 MINS, you would noticed it... And even counting all features of AoP2 (while discounting, that AoP2 have better engine), build mod will have much more features when finished, than AoP2...

And if We take your writings serious, what, in your opinion, we should do now? To satisfy one of ouer possible costumer, which wont going to pay for ouer work, which we made on our free time?

-you can't look around the character (by pressing CTRL)

You can do it while pressing double-tab in free camera mode...

-outdated graphics

Only water... Other things are only modeling, which most of the part are already ported from newer games...

-unnecessarily large icons and interface buttons

That's your sense of taste... I would prefer them even more bigger...

-sidestepping is messed up

Don't like it... Fix it... Remember, that you're trying alpha/beta version... It's far from release...

-ship particles outdated

You were sailing with wrong ship...

-you can't quickly go to places in town through a menu

You were playing with realistic mod, you need to find tavern first, to be able to fast-travel to it later... It's called explorer mod, made to force players to explore islands and towns...

-overall doesn't feel as polished as AoP

...

We worked many h on this, respect that while playing, and don't complain... We won't get payed for that... We aren't making this to satisfy customers, We are making this for us self to joy...

 

[Captain Maggee]

Critism can be good, but I do think after only 10 minutes its a bit rich to make a fool judgement about a game

 

[StevenSSX]

No no please don't get the wrong feeling from me. I was just wondering why these things weren't fixed I didn't mean to say that your work wasn't good... I know anybody who mods can improve some of the things I mentioned, but it seems like the modders are more concerned about gameplay rather than graphics. Like I said though I'll stay with AoP because I prefer graphics. No harm done though!

 

[Seb]

No problem We try to change that aspect of the game in the limits of our possibilities. (I particularly think about the engine limitations). We are aware of that aspect of things and we're feeling it too. We got several victories in that way. We worked a long time to change many textures of the stock game (for exemple the stock game sky textures), we adapted the ENB series system for POTC to implement Bloom, our modelers keep working on ships. One of our members performed new effects for the fires and the cannon shoots that is are a great improvement on the stock game ones. Another worked on the way waves are generated. We are working on the interface constantly. And, I'm myself taking time to adapt the AOP ships details (such as anchors, bells, ect...) to stock POTC ships. ^^

But in matter of modding, anything takes a certain time and often brings a lot of frustrations

 

[Captain Maggee]

Here is an idea StevenSSX, play the vanilla game of PotC and then try Build 14 Beta 1 after it

You will be amazed at how much graphical things have been tweaked. The things that have improved later games (AOP, AOP2) are more Engine related to which we are on version 2.0 where as they are on 2.8... we cant do ANYTHING about that

 

[Hylie Pistof]

I've never played AOP. So all I can say about it is "whatever floats your boat."

But about graphics....... you are comparing apples and oranges. I mainly play a car sim that came out in 1998 (That I seem to be on sabbatical from). That is DX7 stuff. People always want to compare it to the later DX9 sims, but it doesn't work that way. All of the features of the newer games can be implemented in older games, but because the older versions of direct x are so much less efficient there isn't a pc you can buy that could run them. The same thing is happening here IMO. Improving the graphics will result in poor fps. It is a balancing act between performance and looks. The modders of that old car sim are up against the wall of DX7 and are working on converting it to DX11. Sure that will allow things like HDR, but most importantly it will make the graphics better by doing a lot more with a lot less resources.

The same thing applies here. DX8 isn't as efficient as DX9, so you can't expect the same graphics and performance.

It seems to me that what is keeping this game going is the large, detailed world you get to explore, not the latest graphics.

 

[Stallion]

And on the plus side, folks with older computers can still play the modded game with relatively good frame rates. Heck, I still play Stunts, which will be celebrating its 20th birthday come October - sure, it looks like crap, but it certainly doesn't play like crap.

Not saying there's anything wrong with preferring graphics over gameplay - you just should play the game for longer than a few minutes to give a verdict like that. People work on this game as a hobby, not as a career.

 

[Captain Maggee]

Stunts!! OMG I had that on floppy disk

 

[carmenara]

And if We take your writings serious, what, in your opinion, we should do now? To satisfy one of ouer possible costumer, which wont going to pay for ouer work, which we made on our free time?

Thats the holier-than-thou lack of diplomacy that caused me to stop contributing to development in a heartbeat. Thanks for reminding me of such.

Steven's points are completely valid, this is a dated game engine and no amount of love and attention can cure some of its major flaws, but, as the Builders above would put it themselves, there are ways around the common observations and such issues to maximise the performance and utility of POTC + Build.

The overly large icons can be solved by going into an ini file in the root directory, making the game windowed at a reasonably high resolution such as 1440x900 for a 21+ inch widescreen LCD. Graphical quality admittedly depends on the computer system in question. I'm using an ATI Radeon which other than some driver issues causing memory loss (bad for long-duration gaming), the 2003 game engine looks surprisingly up to date with the hardware bells and whistles turned up. Other cards may have issues with (such as the) water rendering making the glitter particles abnormally large, as I've seen with some screenshots.

There is also the ENB graphics enhancement which bears a lot of potential by (I think) updating the DirectX renderers. Just look at Pieter's screenshots. That should make better use of your high horsepower system and hopefully solve some graphical gripes along the way. Just don't run in default resolutions or the icons will be forever large.

But if and when the game works right, the sheer amount of well-hidden additional content blows the unexpecting player away, and this is what the Builders aim to achieve. Sea Dogs in its basic formulae still, to date, offers very much more in gameplay than yon average completable-in-24-hours action RPG, and while the Builders' approach to their expansion is not to everyone's taste due to its non commercial focus, it is arguably its lack of stinky bureaucracy that makes it the best of the age of sail modding community.

To me it's sort of a realism mod like the many GWX, LWAMI etc etc modifications that exist to make naval warfare games better. I did spend some amount of time to hopefully improve some aspects of it and bring a few new boats onto the playing field, and excuse my French but even before I started tinkering for-own-profit, Build was and still is bloody awesome.

And that my dear comrades is how I believe we should approach the issue of in-your-face feedback. It's never about facing off with the poster where he/she is merely posting in good faith to try and make things better in whichever way. It's about harnessing the new energy they bring and channeling the new ideas and perspectives they bring and putting them in line with the Builders' mode of thinking.

But of course, since the post is made by me, I don't expect any sort of respect in return. But when none was given to me when I posted Steven-style feedback last month, should I care?

 

[superdurnius]

But of course, since the post is made by me, I don't expect any sort of respect in return. But when none was given to me when I posted Steven-style feedback last month, should I care?

I DO sometimes act as an asshole, but I'm trying to respect everyone ...

Offended you? Sorry... Not the last time, I guess ...

 

[Audessy]

Why the hype? The amount of gameplay given to you in this mod is phenominal. You could play each one of these stories 10 times over and play it uniquely. There's things to be found everywhere, rare weapons (some funny ones ), unique ships, upgradeable ships and the list goes on and on. This is seriously one of the funnest games I've ever played and probably will play... And that says a lot because I'm more of a Silent Hunter, IL-2, NavyFIELD kind of guy. Only game that ever came close to this with replay value in my book is Fallout 2.

 

[StevenSSX]

Thanks Snow White, that is exactly what I want people to feel.

 

[Captain Maggee]

All I can say mate is we have said something about all the points you have made about the bad
- game engine limitations
- free camera
- age of original game
- realistic settings
- sidestep = BUG

The only one we can do anything about is the interface pictures and SWS told you how to do them, you will have to do this yourself cause as I said before, no one else has complained about this (everyone likes different things). I do think I should warn you though, changing the interface picture/button size requires a lot of editing (files are in RESOURCE\INI\INTERFACES(OR NEW_INTERFACES))

 

[StevenSSX]

Actually the interface isn't that bad when you get used to it. It's just the icons at sea are large compared to AoP. The gameplay is really good though. The only thing I'd like is if that damn sidestepping bug was fixed. :/

 

[Captain Maggee]

Yes we all wish that

You can disable it if you really want to (I just cant remember how ). Easier still dont use the buttons

 

[Pieter Boelen]

The original game didn't have sidestep; we added that.
It was a horizontal teleport before, but it was improved to a slide.
The character models don't have sidestep animation (except some from AoP, such as the Devlin ones),
so without those animations, we can't make it look better.
There's also no collision detection. We did try adding that, but failed.
So as it stands, it is either weird sidestep or no sidestep.

As for graphical improvements, of course we want those as much as you do.
But most is locked away in the engine and we cannot change.
We did improve a lot as said before, also as graphics are concerned,
but there's many limitations there on what we can't do.
Hopefully we'll eventually get the game's source code and then we'll be able to do something about that properly.
In the meantime, at least we got the graphics as good as we can and now we focus mainly on gameplay and modeling.

Maybe we'll port to CoAS one day, but not not likely before Build 14 is complete.