[NH-14b4] A view questions...

[Hotshot]

Hi there mates!

As I've played the good 'ol Sea Dogs with (your) mods, I wanted to try the next game in the series, especially with your New Horizon Mod.
But all the options and intricacies are a bit... lets say confusing for lack of a better word^^
And although there are numerous FAQs/Wiki pages and what not, I did not find anything related to my following questions and I'm really hoping for some clarifications
(keep in mind I come from Sea Dogs 1^^)

Game Start (aka Storyline aka Main-Quest)

• Can I play all main quests with the default "Nathaniel" game?
• Or do I always have to start "from scratch"?

Character

• There are a whole LOT of different characters...
• different Nation, Group (like Officer), "Fame Level" and even Officer Type
• w00t does that all mean!?
• As this probably defines a whole lot in game, I would really like to know more (everything^^)

Playing Style (aka Background)

• Wiki-Link
• Is this still relevant?
  
• Because there are a lot more and they only differ in their "main skills", right?
• -> so what would be the available ranks/ships for "Sword Master" or "Army Veteran"?

As you can see: the main questions are about the different "game modes". As I'm surely not the only one wondering about all that, an updated Wiki page with every bit of info in it would be absolutely awesome!

InternalSettings.h
The settings from "BuildSettings.h" are ingame, so this ought to be the only settings-file one "could" change outside, right?

• Would I need to start a new game after changing something in there?
• How could I set realistic options for "Arcade Gameplay"? I only see some options for Realistic and Iron Man
  
• #define NAVIGATION_EQUIPMENT
  • what does that mean/do?
• #define CANNOT_RELOAD_WHILE_FIGHTING 1 // INT - 1=DEFAULT: Controlled by Realism Mode - 0 or 2 override the Realism Mode setting
  • that's not very clear either; is it meant for handguns? What's setting 2 and how does it relate to the "Realism Mode" setting?
• #define WEAPONSLOCKER 1
  • what's a weapons locker? Is this on the ship and do I have to fill it with guns and swords before boarding?
• #define CREW_PCT_FOR_MORALE 0.02 // FLOAT - morale decreases by 1 for each time crew decreases by this pct.
  • could you please give me an explanation on this setting?
• #define SHIPYARD_SHIP_SELL_MULT 0.30 // FLOAT - multiplier to sell price for ship - non rpgstyle shipyards
  • what (where?) are "non rpgstyle shipyards"?
• #define SHIPYARD_RPG_LPC 3
  • I dont' really get it: there are only 12 player levels, right? (like in Sea Dogs), so a setting higher then 2 doesn't make any sense, because you wouldn't be able to buy Class 2 ships? (Class 1 are not sold, right?)

Sea Dogs Music

• this was definitly one, if not the most important aspect that made this game great, so is its music included in PotC / New Horizon?
• probably not, so is there a way to "include" it?
• and I don't mean like playing it through Winamp: I mean that the right music plays for the action on screen:
  • British ships fight: british theme song
  • Nothing happening: default theme
  • and so on

ships_init.c
I've coded myself a WebApp to display all ships with their stats: http://www.stumpfl.at.tf/PotC-Ships (I've disabled the loading of new ship files for this online version -> if you'd like this tool for your online wiki just tell me via PM and I can give you the source)
Because this app reads your Ships_init.c I've come across some (minor) errors; more specifically missing semicolons at these lines (version 14 Beta 4.0):

• 6179
• 9920
• 10018
• 10115
• 10206
• 10303
• 13979
• 14110
• 14241

--------------------------------------
Well, that's it for now, but I'm sure I'll have more question after starting the mod ;-)

Thank you very much in advance for trying to help!

Sincerely,
Hotshot

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Ahoy there, @Hotshot! Welcome as PotC player.

Can I play all main quests with the default "Nathaniel" game?

There are different Storylines to choose from, each with their own unique main quest. See here:
New Horizons Quests | PiratesAhoy!
The exception is the Free Play one, which only has an opening scene, but no main quest.
These storylines are each unique in their own way.

However, the following Side Quests are available in (almost) all storylines:
New Horizons Side Quest List | PiratesAhoy!
Which ones are not are marked on that same page.

If you start as Nathaniel Hawk, then you get the storyline from the unmodded PotC game as well as all the sidequests.

• There are a whole LOT of different characters...

• different Nation, Group (like Officer), "Fame Level" and even Officer Type

• w00t does that all mean!?

• As this probably defines a whole lot in game, I would really like to know more (everything^^)

You're talking about the interface you get when you click on your character portrait, right?
All those buttons are "filter settings" to help you find the character model you want.
As you can freely choose from almost all models available in the game (several hundreds), scrolling through them would take forever.
Those buttons allow you to find specifically English models or named characters or ones appropriate for a certain officer type.

Only the buttons directly on this interface affect the actual game:
http://www.piratesahoy.net/attachments/storylinefrancisdrake-jpg.26580/

The date affects the historical time period (can only be chosen in the Free Play storyline).
The nation affects your starting relations (but these may change during the game).
Background profession affects your starting skills and items.

Most important though are your actions during the game. Nothing is truly set in stone.

Playing Style (aka Background)

• Wiki-Link
• Is this still relevant?
  
• Because there are a lot more and they only differ in their "main skills", right?
• -> so what would be the available ranks/ships for "Sword Master" or "Army Veteran"?

That Wiki page is brand new and very relevant, but "Playing Style" is not the same as "Background Profession".
While some professions may set you on your path for a specific playing style, you can change your playing style during the game through your actions.
The only exception is the "Naval Officer" playing style, which can only be started by selecting the "Naval Officer" background profession.

@Talisman spent a lot of time on the Wiki recently and the information on there should be quite accurate.

Would I need to start a new game after changing something in there?

That depends on the setting. Most settings work on savegames, some require F11 to be pressed and some require a new game.

InternalSettings.h

The realism settings at the top can be used to set various game elements to a higher realism level.
Most of them are included in the ingame Realism Level setting, but this allows a bit more control.
If you use Arcade, you can set various of those numbers to "1" if you do want them.

NAVIGATION_EQUIPMENT = Realistic setting is that your ship position doesn't show on the Archipelago Map unless you've got a Sextant and Chronometer equipped.
It might also limit Sail-To menu options to having the required spyglass item; I don't remember now....

CANNOT_RELOAD_WHILE_FIGHTING = It is for hand guns, yes. Realistic = Gun doesn't reload unless you have your sword sheathed.

WEAPONSLOCKER = Play through the Tutorial of the Nathaniel Hawk storyline.
Malcolm Hatcher explains that.

CREW_PCT_FOR_MORALE = Setting that affects the way morale behaves. I recommend leaving that as-is.

SHIPYARD_SHIP_SELL_MULT = Relates to one of the settings in the ingame Settings menu.
Can't remember its exact name, but it is the one that controls whether ship sale prices differ depending on how you got the ship.
E.g. a legal prize ship sells for more money than a pirated ship does.
This setting only takes effect if you don't use that feature.

SHIPYARD_RPG_LPC = I don't remember that one at all. Tier 1 ships can be sold, but they're very, very rare.

Sea Dogs Music

Some of the Sea Dogs tracks are included, most notably the ones I liked best.
You'll notice an obvious one when walking around Spanish towns. Since that track was very long, I split it into several shorter ones.
More music can be added with relative ease.

It isn't so easy to have sea battle music depend on the nation you're fighting though.
Multiple nations can be part of the same encounter and there may be other ships around that approach during the battle as well.
So there is only "general sea battle music".

I've coded myself a WebApp to display all ships with their stats: http://www.stumpfl.at.tf/PotC-Ships (I've disabled the loading of new ship files for this online version -> if you'd like this tool for your online wiki just tell me via PM and I can give you the source)
Because this app reads your Ships_init.c I've come across some (minor) errors; more specifically missing semicolons at these lines (version 14 Beta 4.0):

That is seriously cool, that is! I think @Armada and @Talisman may be quite interested in that.

 

[Grey Roger]

ships_init.c
I've coded myself a WebApp to display all ships with their stats: http://www.stumpfl.at.tf/PotC-Ships (I've disabled the loading of new ship files for this online version -> if you'd like this tool for your online wiki just tell me via PM and I can give you the source)
Because this app reads your Ships_init.c I've come across some (minor) errors; more specifically missing semicolons at these lines (version 14 Beta 4.0):

• 6179
• 9920
• 10018
• 10115
• 10206
• 10303
• 13979
• 14110
• 14241

Beta 4.0 is now slightly outdated. You can get Beta 4.1 here:
Mod Release - Build 14 Beta 4.1 WIP | PiratesAhoy!

But the version of "Ships_init.c" in Beta 4.1 is also missing the semi-colons. There's an obvious solution - add them! See the attached file.

 

[Mere_Mortal]

If you hate missing semi-colons, you’ll hate me because I hate semi-colons.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

If you hate missing semi-colons, you’ll hate me because I hate semi-colons.

The game code can be quite picky and finicky.
It is much safer to add semi-colons everywhere, just like in the unmodded game.
Wouldn't want to risk weird stuff happening because of a silly reason like this.

Spoiler

I'm not sure how much of a difference it makes. And I'm hoping to never find out.
I like the Matlab logic where a line with a semi-colon is not printed, while one without it is.
At least then it has a clear meaning.

 

[Hotshot]

add them!

I did that of course

Thank you all on your input on semi-colons
That was actually only a side note *lol*. I'd much rather have my other questions answered, please^^

I just had to add this; this gotta be the biggest emoji EVER

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Thank you all on your input on semi-colons
That was actually only a side note *lol*. I'd much rather have my other questions answered, please^^

Did I not already cover all your other questions with post #2 above???

 

[Hotshot]

Did I not already cover all your other questions with post #2 above???

OMFG, I guess I'll walk the plank voluntarily... how the fuck could I not see your first post is beyond me! Mea culpa!

Game Start
So the character choice is purely cosmetic? I can play the default "Nathanial" Storyline as "Nathanial" but with the Blackbeard skin?

And now after reading your post and re-re-reading the "Playing Styles" page I get it! Now it makes much more sense!

But I guess I cannot change to "Naval Officer" after game start, right? But what happens if I get a LoM as an Officer or attack ships from my own country? Do I automatically change into the "Privateer" play style (meaning I get kicked from the Navy?)

• "Cannot Swap Ships until rank 7": does that mean that I can capture ships (and my First Mates sail them) or does it mean I cannot even capture said ships (to sell them for instance)?

Settings
Ok, so "included in xyz" means that even if a specific realism setting is disabled, it would be enabled for the specified realism setting?
So these settings actually ARE to make "Arcade" more realistic? *awesome*

• CANNOT_RELOAD_WHILE_FIGHTING: that means "2" is "on"?

Music
Ok, after listening to most of the .ogg files it's obvious that they (you?) included the default Sea Dogs music; but there are a lot of other samples as well, so I can only hope that the SD1 stuff get's played often^^

It isn't so easy to have sea battle music depend on the nation you're fighting though.

But there is the "music_potcmovie" mod that does exactly that, does it not?
Anyway, moot point as Sea Dogs music is included anyway

And finally: as the 4.1 update is still WIP: is it stable/safe to install or should I wait for the release? I'm asking because I'm itching to finally start NH and I've kept my cool to wait for v14^^

That is seriously cool, that is! I think @Armada and @Talisman may be quite interested in that.

Thanks! I'd be happy to send you the source code; just tell me where to

Thank you very much for all your answers!!

 

[Pieter Boelen]

OMFG, I guess I'll walk the plank voluntarily... how the fuck could I not see your first post is beyond me! Mea culpa!

So the character choice is purely cosmetic? I can play the default "Nathanial" Storyline as "Nathanial" but with the Blackbeard skin?

If you want to, sure.

But I guess I cannot change to "Naval Officer" after game start, right?

Not through general gameplay, though it is easy enough through console.
The "Naval Officer" gameplay is brand new and joining in mid-game would require some additional logic to be created, which we didn't bother doing just yet.

But what happens if I get a LoM as an Officer

If you start the game as a Naval Officer, you cannot buy any Letters of Marque.
Reason being: You sort-of already have one. (And as far as the underlying game code is concerned, you REALLY have one! )

But what happens if I [...] attack ships from my own country?

You get kicked out of the service, lose your ranks and get branded a pirate.
If you like, you can then continue playing as a pirate and even join the Brotherhood. Or become a Privateer in the service of another nation.
Theoretically you could even become a Privateer in service of your former nation again, if you buy amnesty afterwards.

Do I automatically change into the "Privateer" play style (meaning I get kicked from the Navy?)

A Privateer still has a Letter of Marque. If you betrayed your own country, then you'll be left with not even that.
But yes, you do get kicked out.

"Cannot Swap Ships until rank 7": does that mean that I can capture ships (and my First Mates sail them) or does it mean I cannot even capture said ships (to sell them for instance)?

You can capture ships and take them as prize. You can keep those in your fleet or sell them. But you cannot sail those captured ships yourself.
The idea is that the Navy ordered you to command the ship you currently have and you must do what you're told.
You get new ships for free upon being promoted in the Navy.

Once you become Commodore, then that limitation is lifted as you are then considered senior enough to command a proper fleet.
It is then your choice which ship you want to use as your flagship.

Ok, so "included in xyz" means that even if a specific realism setting is disabled, it would be enabled for the specified realism setting?
So these settings actually ARE to make "Arcade" more realistic? *awesome*

Correct. Most of those settings can only be used to make the game more realistic.

CANNOT_RELOAD_WHILE_FIGHTING: that means "2" is "on"?

That one is the exception to what I stated above, because you can set it to "0" to make the game less realistic.
But yes, "2" is indeed "on" for Arcade game mode as well.

Ok, after listening to most of the .ogg files it's obvious that they (you?) included the default Sea Dogs music; but there are a lot of other samples as well, so I can only hope that the SD1 stuff get's played often^^

Not all the Sea Dogs music is in there, but a lot of it is.
The game cycles through the music in order, so you each track should get somewhat equal play time.

Adding/removing music is quite easy even for novice modders (though a New Game may be required for the changes to take effect).

But there is the "music_potcmovie" mod that does exactly that, does it not?
Anyway, moot point as Sea Dogs music is included anyway

The music in towns and taverns is nation-specific.
The music in sea battles isn't.

And finally: as the 4.1 update is still WIP: is it stable/safe to install or should I wait for the release? I'm asking because I'm itching to finally start NH and I've kept my cool to wait for v14^^

I've been taking great care to make the Beta 4.1 WIP as stable as possible.
It is probably more stable than the Beta 4.0 public release as it contains some important additional fixes.
Any new, unstable and untested content has not been included in any combined modpack files yet.

There may be another Beta 4.1 WIP update somewhere this weekend as there have been some new updates and corrections that I should probably include.
You should definitely NOT wait for a non-beta release, because that is going to take a LONG time.

Thanks! I'd be happy to send you the source code; just tell me where to

Maybe you can ZIP it up and attach it to a forum post?

 

[Hotshot]

Ok, I'll try 14b4.1 then

• Wow, behind-the-scenes calculations must've changed a lot: for instance "GCCOSTMULT" got a raise from 5 to 2000

Naval Officer sounds really interesting... I guest this time I'll have to do two playthroughs!

As I've not found this yet: what's the max level one can get? Is it still 12 as in SD1? Interests me on how many skill/ability points one can get...

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Wow, behind-the-scenes calculations must've changed a lot: for instance "GCCOSTMULT" got a raise from 5 to 2000

The code using that was indeed completely modified by @Mere_Mortal.
The resulting values aren't actually 400 times larger though.

Naval Officer sounds really interesting... I guest this time I'll have to do two playthroughs!

All of the separate storylines are worthwhile as well and each unique in your own way.
You can probably do TEN playthroughs and still not have experienced it all.

As I've not found this yet: what's the max level one can get? Is it still 12 as in SD1? Interests me on how many skill/ability points one can get...

There is no maximum level, but each next level does get progressively harder to reach.
Eventually you can max out all your skills; those go up to 10. And you can probably get all abilities by the time you reach level 50.
But that'll all take you a while. Better to hire some officers to take care of some of that for you.

 

[Hotshot]

I've just realized that - of course - not every ship is available in all periods... and so I should include the periods in my Ship-Tool.

So I need to ask for some clarification:

    refShip.period.0 = 0.0; //
    refShip.period.1 = 0.0; //
    refShip.period.2 = 0.0; //
    refShip.period.3 = 0.0; //
    refShip.period.4 = 0.3; //
    refShip.period.5 = 0.5; //

1. Could you pls explain the possible values for "#define PERIOD_ACCURACY_LEVEL" in detail?
2. What are the 5 time periods (including the dates)
3. What do these numbers mean/do? Is it something like the "likelihood" that this ship can be encountered? Has it anything to do about the chances that I can buy the ship?

And while we are at it: can one actually progress through time periods? If I set my game start near the end of one for instance?
I guess the default Main Quest is "locked" with the ships in this age, so I will not be able to get my hands on just any ship, right?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Grey Roger]

1: The comment on that line is:

PB: 1 = Simplified 0% or 100% Period+Nation chance, 0 = Period chance ignored

I'm not sure what a default value of 2 means, but I'm guessing that the value doesn't matter unless it's 0, in which case period and nation are ignored and you can meet any ship owned by any nation in any period.

2: Periods are as follows:

• 0: Early Explorers (1500 - 1599)
  
• 1: Spanish Main (1600 - 1679)
  
• 2: Golden Age of Piracy (1680 - 1739)
  
• 3: Colonial Powers (1740 - 1769)
  
• 4: Revolutions (1770 - 1789)
  
• 5: Napoleonic (1790 - 1830)

Counting starts from 0 so there are 6 periods, not 5. Dates, and other information about periods, can be found in "PROGRAM\Periods.c".

3: Yes, they're to do with the chances of the ship being encountered. I don't know how the exact chances are calculated but you'll see similar numbers in the Nations section, e.g. 'refShip.england = 0.06', which also factor into the calculation.

Chances of buying the ship will also depend on the shipyard. And if you don't have high enough rank in the service of the nation where you're trying to buy the ship then you won't be allowed to buy naval ships at all - they may show up but the interface will tell you that you can't buy them. You can't buy a 1st rate unless you're rank 10, and then only in the biggest shipyards. (Various settings in "PROGRAM\InternalSettings.h" control this.)

 

[Hotshot]

Sweet, thanks for the update!
I need to think on how to display that in my tool though...

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Could you pls explain the possible values for "#define PERIOD_ACCURACY_LEVEL" in detail?

At the default setting of 2, everything works the way it should.
At 1, any ship with an encounter chance greater than 0.0 is set to 1.0 in an attempt to increase the variety and not make certain ships less common
At 0, all chance values are set to 1.0 and periods no longer matter

You can probably just ignore all that. I added it for the few people who don't like the whole Period feature.
I don't think anyone uses it.

And while we are at it: can one actually progress through time periods? If I set my game start near the end of one for instance?
I guess the default Main Quest is "locked" with the ships in this age, so I will not be able to get my hands on just any ship, right?

No, you can't. Once you start the game in a certain period, you're locked into that period for the entire playthrough.

The periods affect rather a lot, including the soldier models, flags used, island and town names, governor names and most importantly ship availability.
So locking the player to a single period once the game has started makes things much simpler for us on the coding side.

It also makes for added replay value. Plus it would take forever to get from Early Explorers to Napoleonic anyway.

 

[Grey Roger]

At the default setting of 2, everything works the way it should.
At 1, any ship with an encounter chance greater than 0.0 is set to 1.0 in an attempt to increase the variety and not make certain ships less common
At 2, all chance values are set to 1.0 and periods no longer matter

Bearing in mind that it's set by default to 2, which of the above definitions of 2 is correct? (I assume that "all chance values are set to 1.0 and periods no longer matter" is not "everything works the way it should". )

No, you can't. Once you start the game in a certain period, you're locked into that period for the entire playthrough.

The periods affect rather a lot, including the soldier models, flags used, island and town names, governor names and most importantly ship availability.
So locking the player to a single period once the game has started makes things much simpler for us on the coding side.

It also makes for added replay value. Plus it would take forever to get from Early Explorers to Napoleonic anyway.

But it doesn't take that long to get from "Early Explorers" to "Spanish Main" if you start in 1599. Or, for that matter, to get from "Golden Age" to "Colonial Powers" if you start in 1738, which you will if you select Danielle Greene as a Free Play character.

The point about making the coding a lot simpler is valid, though. Besides, even if it did work, the effect would probably be that at 00:01 on 1st January 1740 all the soldier uniforms change, several types of ship cease to exist and several others suddenly appear. This is even less realistic than just continuing with the "Golden Age" uniforms and ships. So, both from a modding point of view and from a playing point of view, it makes sense to stick with one period throughout the game, then pick a different period when you start a new game.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Bearing in mind that it's set by default to 2, which of the above definitions of 2 is correct? (I assume that "all chance values are set to 1.0 and periods no longer matter" is not "everything works the way it should". )

I mistyped in my post. Corrected now above.

But it doesn't take that long to get from "Early Explorers" to "Spanish Main" if you start in 1599. Or, for that matter, to get from "Golden Age" to "Colonial Powers" if you start in 1738, which you will if you select Danielle Greene as a Free Play character.

The point about making the coding a lot simpler is valid, though. Besides, even if it did work, the effect would probably be that at 00:01 on 1st January 1740 all the soldier uniforms change, several types of ship cease to exist and several others suddenly appear. This is even less realistic than just continuing with the "Golden Age" uniforms and ships. So, both from a modding point of view and from a playing point of view, it makes sense to stick with one period throughout the game, then pick a different period when you start a new game.

All true.