Released Repainted HMS Victory

[Armada]

It seems I'm a bit late, but I recently discovered that the real HMS Victory was repainted last year as part of her ongoing restoration. Check out this video for a comparison:

Her new paint scheme was derived from forensic analysis of wood samples that revealed the "true" colours she would have had around the time of the Battle of Trafalgar. Compared to the yellowy-orange and black stripes we've all been used to for the past few decades, the new cream and black paint scheme with a brighter red around the gunports looks very striking. Apparently it was a little divisive at first, but personally I kind of prefer it over the old colours.

As such... I thought our own model of the Victory could do with a new coat of paint.

The new textures and HEX-edited hull model are available here: VictoryRepaint.7z
The hull GM goes in RESOURCE\MODELS\Ships\HMS_Victory, and the textures go in RESOURCE\Textures\Ships. Be sure to make a back-up of your original Victory files if you want to revert to the old paint scheme!

What do you think of the new colours, both on the real ship and the in-game model?

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Wow, I did not see that one coming! Very cool.

 

[Armada]

I thought this would be a nice surprise.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

I thought this would be a nice Surprise.

Nice Victory, more like.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

@Armada, for implementation in the mod, perhaps the interface screenshot should be replaced as well?

I'm now comparing "RN_FirstRate" with "HMS_Victory" and already the Victory had more "muted" colours.
Interesting to have her look even more distinct from her "generic counterpart"!

That video is cool as well. Nice time-lapse video of her being painted.
Does make me wonder though if you got the "red" right; in the video it looks more vivid than in GM Viewer.
And they mentioned the colour of the masts as well; are those still the right shade then?

 

[Armada]

@Armada, for implementation in the mod, perhaps the interface screenshot should be replaced as well?

If most people prefer this new paint scheme over the old one, then sure. I took the first screenshot above with the interface image in mind, so that can be cropped for the texture.
Has ShipsBL.tga been changed since I uploaded the PSD files? If so, we'll need the latest version from whoever edited it last.

Does make me wonder though if you got the "red" right; in the video it looks more vivid than in GM Viewer.
And they mentioned the colour of the masts as well; are those still the right shade then?

I made the red texture brighter than it used to be, but perhaps it needs to be slightly brighter still. On the other hand, I might have made the blue bulkhead a bit too bright, so I'll tweak that as well.

I did change the mast texture, since it used to be orange like the rest of the hull.

 

[Armada]

Here's a small update with brighter red and darker blue textures.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Has ShipsBL.tga been changed since I uploaded the PSD files? If so, we'll need the latest version from whoever edited it last.

Possibly... can't remember now. If someone did, it was @Grey Roger.

If most people prefer this new paint scheme over the old one, then sure.

Nobody seems to have commented here yet, so I think I'm going to make the decision myself.
You new version goes IN the modpack and if people have questions about it, we'll point them to that video.
More accurate + more different from the other version of the same ship = good reason to have this one instead, I think.

I made the red texture brighter than it used to be, but perhaps it needs to be slightly brighter still. On the other hand, I might have made the blue bulkhead a bit too bright, so I'll tweak that as well.

Would be great! As they say in the video, the new red is quite bright and striking, so it will be awesome for the PotC version to give the same effect.

I did change the mast texture, since it used to be orange like the rest of the hull.

Was that texture already different from the one used by RN_FirstRate?
I wondered because you only included a HEX-edited hull, but no HEX-edited masts.
But maybe I didn't pay proper attention. That is very possible, as I was a bit rushed at the time....

 

[Armada]

Nobody seems to have commented here yet, so I think I'm going to make the decision myself.
You new version goes IN the modpack and if people have questions about it, we'll point them to that video.
More accurate + more different from the other version of the same ship = good reason to have this one instead, I think.

Fair enough, I'm not complaining.

Was that texture already different from the one used by RN_FirstRate?
I wondered because you only included a HEX-edited hull, but no HEX-edited masts.

Yes, it was already a unique texture. I only HEX-edited the hull to replace shared textures with unique ones.

 

[Grey Roger]

Has ShipsBL.tga been changed since I uploaded the PSD files? If so, we'll need the latest version from whoever edited it last.

I did change the "ShipsXX.tga" files to accommodate various changes, such as my new French ships and the "CastelF" variants. But those should all be in the current version of the Build Mod, so if you have the 18th June version (or even one of the previous couple of versions) then you should have the latest files.

But I'm less happy about having Victory be a different colour from other British naval ships. In reality they'd have been painted a standard colour, so if this colour scheme is more realistic then it ought to apply to all of them. HMS Victory might have had different colours in the 19th century to what you'd have seen on her in Portsmouth a year or two ago, but she wouldn't have had different colours to every other ship in the British fleet at Trafalgar. The other thing to note is that bright red might have been correct when she was fresh out of the dockyard but I'll bet the gunports wouldn't have been that bright after a year at sea and a couple of battles. Weather and cannon smoke would have had an effect.

 

[Armada]

I did change the "ShipsXX.tga" files to accommodate various changes, such as my new French ships and the "CastelF" variants. But those should all be in the current version of the Build Mod, so if you have the 18th June version (or even one of the previous couple of versions) then you should have the latest files.

I'm on about the layered PSD files. It would be easier to change the image that way instead of modifying the flat TGA file to overlay another copy of the grid on top of it.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

But I'm less happy about having Victory be a different colour from other British naval ships.

That would indeed be a bit odd. But the actual HMS Victory doesn't show up in the game, except potentially as a player ship.
So there I don't see a huge issue with her being different from the other ships.

If we go by 100% logic there, then "HMS_Victory" and "RN_FirstRate" become virtually indistinguishable from each other, apart from their nameplate.
Plus who is going to repaint ALL English ships in the mod? That'll be a huge task! And who is to say the paint used didn't differ a bit from ship-to-ship?
There are a lot of different ships for the same nation added by different people currently in the mod and therefore they all have somewhat differing colour schemes.

 

[Grey Roger]

The whole idea is that "HMS_Victory" and "RN_FirstRate" be virtually indistinguishable! If these colours are realistic then "RN_FirstRate" should be using them. So should "HMS_Dauntless" and "HMS_Endeavour".

Not all English ships need to be repainted. Just the ones for "Revolutions" and "Napoleonic". As for paint differing from ship to ship, perhaps a bit, but not to the extent seen if you compare new "HMS_Victory" to "HMS_Dauntless" - which is in serious need of a repaint anyway because looking at the texture file, it appears to be blue and dark yellow, with the same dark blue below the waterline as between the yellow lines above. As for the rest, a lot of them share the same texture files so editing those common files would take care of most of the fleet.

If the consensus is that new "HMS_Victory" is better than old and is to be kept, I'll deal with the others. I've done it before, that's how the Revolutionary French navy got its new paint scheme. In any case, "HMS_Dauntless" is getting a repaint - copper bottom, black stripes, and whichever shade of cream is to be used for "HMS_Victory".

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Here's a small update with brighter red and darker blue textures.

Thanks again! I like it.

Not all English ships need to be repainted. Just the ones for "Revolutions" and "Napoleonic".

As much as I like their original paint schemes, I don't think I can come up with a valid excuse why all other Revolutions and Napoleonic ships should not be updated to match the Victory.
Other than the fact that I like the the "unique Victory" being notably different (and more historically accurate) than the generic "RN_FirstRate".

Of course at the moment there is absolutely NO consensus yet as only the three of us have commented so far.
Based on that, perhaps it would be worth to include only the new Victory and use that one to find out if there actually is a "general consensus" to be found?

"HMS_Dauntless" - which is in serious need of a repaint anyway because looking at the texture file, it appears to be blue and dark yellow, with the same dark blue below the waterline as between the yellow lines above.

If you're comparing paint schemes, you should compare "HMS_Victory" with "RN_FirstRate".
HMS Dauntless is a fictional PotC film ship, just like the HMS Interceptor.
Interceptor was very recently repainted by @Legendary_Spider to be more detailed and accurate to the film, which resulted in here being also being more blue and dark yellow.
If the Dauntless is to be repainted, I'd say she should match the Interceptor's paint scheme, not the "new" Victory's one.

If the consensus is that new "HMS_Victory" is better than old and is to be kept, I'll deal with the others. I've done it before, that's how the Revolutionary French navy got its new paint scheme.

Your willingness is very much appreciated!
And I've got to admit... there is something very appealing about the idea of PotC being (one of?) the first game(s) in existence with the most historically accurate English fleet!

 

[Grey Roger]

Hmm... looking at some YouTube footage of both ships, I'd say the blue has been overdone. But, fair enough - leave the completely fictitious ships in completely fictitious schemes and concentrate on making the realistic ships realistic. Saves me a bit of work.

Talking of accuracy - these ships are in the late periods and are British, not just English.

 

[Armada]

If we go by 100% logic there, then "HMS_Victory" and "RN_FirstRate" become virtually indistinguishable from each other, apart from their nameplate.

Perhaps to maintain Victory's unique appearance, RN_FirstRate should only have its colours changed, but not carry across the photographic stern texture of Victory (without the nameplate).

If the consensus is that new "HMS_Victory" is better than old and is to be kept, I'll deal with the others.

Might it be worth starting a poll on this in the PotC forum? This thread might not be visible enough to most players.

Although I support historical accuracy where appropriate, repainting the British ships would surely mean the French ships should follow suit? A yellow and black paint scheme would probably be far more representative of most Napoleonic French ships than red and black. I understand the need for 'national paint schemes' for gameplay purposes, but this is just something to consider.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

Perhaps to maintain Victory's unique appearance, RN_FirstRate should only have its colours changed, but not carry across the photographic stern texture of Victory (without the nameplate).

If you guys insist they should have the same paint scheme, then that is indeed the only way to distinguish them.

Might it be worth starting a poll on this in the PotC forum? This thread might not be visible enough to most players.

Quite possible that people don't notice this thread here.
With a bit of luck, they WILL notice when the new version is announced in the Beta 4 WIP thread though.

Even if people do notice, hardly anyone ever bothers to respond whenever I ask important things.
Maybe once we get round to actually posting on ModDB, that would attract the needed attention to figure out a "general consensus".

Although I support historical accuracy where appropriate, repainting the British ships would surely mean the French ships should follow suit? A yellow and black paint scheme would probably be far more representative of most Napoleonic French ships than red and black. I understand the need for 'national paint schemes' for gameplay purposes, but this is just something to consider.

Awwww..... I like national paint schemes. They're also fairly "canonical" in films and TV series (even if real history was not quite the same).

I'm beginning to think.... optional texture pack?
Normally I hate "additional downloads" that aren't in the main mod, but that is mostly because it is a pain to keep all code up-to-date.
If it is purely texture files though, it may be more reasonable?

Anyway, I personally don't object to the HMS Victory being given her new look (in fact, I like that for the Victory as most famous historical ship in the game).
But I am perfectly fine with everything else remaining as-is.

 

[Grey Roger]

Perhaps to maintain Victory's unique appearance, RN_FirstRate should only have its colours changed, but not carry across the photographic stern texture of Victory (without the nameplate).

The point is that, other than its nameplate, Victory wasn't unique, it was a Royal Navy first rate ship of the line. It should not look out of place when, playing Nelson as a free play character, you acquire this ship in addition to frigate which you acquired at rank Commodore, or when you gain another first rate ship of the line at rank Admiral. (Which, incidentally, will need to be changed from "Dauntless" to "RN_FirstRate", since "Dauntless" is now in a fictitious blue colour scheme and will remain so.)

Although I support historical accuracy where appropriate, repainting the British ships would surely mean the French ships should follow suit? A yellow and black paint scheme would probably be far more representative of most Napoleonic French ships than red and black. I understand the need for 'national paint schemes' for gameplay purposes, but this is just something to consider.

I looked for various references before deciding on that colour for French ships. For example:

(Click on the image to see the full size version.)

And then I went to a good deal of effort to put that scheme onto all French ships of the "Napoleonic" period. If that is to be wasted then I may as well not bother with British ships and just leave Victory to look wrong when among a British fleet under Nelson's command.

 

[Pieter Boelen]

The point is that, other than its nameplate, Victory wasn't unique, it was a Royal Navy first rate ship of the line. It should not look out of place when, playing Nelson as a free play character, you acquire this ship in addition to frigate which you acquired at rank Commodore, or when you gain another first rate ship of the line at rank Admiral. (Which, incidentally, will need to be changed from "Dauntless" to "RN_FirstRate", since "Dauntless" is now in a fictitious blue colour scheme and will remain so.)

I think I put the Dauntless in use as a promotion reward ship because generally you can encounter the "RN_FirstRate", but not the "HMS_Dauntless" or "HMS_Endeavour" (or account of them being fictional "Vanderdecken" ships).
But now that James Norrington is available as a Free Play character, indeed the Dauntless could be limited to only him and the other PotC film naval officers.

And then I went to a good deal of effort to put that scheme onto all French ships of the "Napoleonic" period. If that is to be wasted then I may as well not bother with British ships and just leave Victory to look wrong when among a British fleet under Nelson's command.

If the choice is mine (and that may very well be the case, unless I'm overruled by a massive majority vote), your French and Spanish paint schemes will remain.

 

[Grey Roger]

About the stern detail on "RN_FirstRate" versus "HMS_Victory": the new "HMS_Victory" has a better detailed flag picture which indeed doesn't need to be copied to "RN_FirstRate" (or any of the other ships with similar flags, e.g. "HMS_Dauntless" and "HMS_Endeavour". Some, though not all, of the windows on "HMS_Victory" are more detailed now; again, that does not need to be copied to the generic ship. Finally, "HMS_Victory" has men standing either side of the middle row of windows whereas "HMS_Dauntless" and "HMS_Endeavour" both just have scrolls similar to those next to the upper row; perhaps copy that to "RN_FirstRate" as well. Then, for all that "HMS_Victory" and "RN_FirstRate" will have the same colour scheme, they'll still be subtly different in more than just nameplate.