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HMS Indefatigable (1784) frigate

Quick update/question #2.

I did separate masts, spars and the rest of the model to different export *.obj files.

i9_maya.png​

When I import an obj into Maya, it works like a single, complicated object (no separation to details).
1. Is it all right, or I should make smaller parts and import them separately?
2. Can I, using this imported chunk, that contains, essentially, the whole ship, add locators and export it to GM, or there is some other magic I should do?
As on the screenshot, I do see my textures, so I very sincerely hope I don't have to do anything new with them.

(the target of conversion at the moment is POTC, as I happen to have it)
 
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Martes said:
Oh, I did fall for that already.
The encounter report said I see Spanish warship vs. British, and decided to join. On a frigate. Then I see two 74-s, one red, one yellow, quite close, rush to the aid of the yellow... only to understand both of them are dons. Barely escaped. :)
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Ouch! :shock

I do wonder why a Spanish ship could be both red and yellow.
@Grey Roger, do you know which ship that might be? And is that intentional?


As for converting to GM, I've never used Maya so cannot help with the specifics.
But from what I heard, you can define the model in pieces and with locators.
The exporting process then cuts up the model and includes the locators.
@Armada should be able to provide more details on that though.
 
Martes said:
It was the Superbe, it's hard to forget them :)
I don't know, maybe some option dropped, that ships may be randomly painted...
Or the computer captured one and used for itself?..
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Thanks. In that case, it must be because two skins of the same model have their nation encounter chances set for Spain.

Random repainting only happens if the ship encounter chances are set up to allow that repaint.
The computer cannot capture ships....
 
Yes, "RN_Superbe" can be used by Britain, Spain, and for that matter everyone except Pirate and America. "FR_Superbe", on the other hand, is limited to France and Spain. So the yellow one will have been "RN_Superbe" and the red one will have been "FR_Superbe". This is actually realistic, in that French and Spanish capital ships could very well appear in varying colours.
 
Grey Roger said:
Yes, "RN_Superbe" can be used by Britain, Spain, and for that matter everyone except Pirate and America. "FR_Superbe", on the other hand, is limited to France and Spain. So the yellow one will have been "RN_Superbe" and the red one will have been "FR_Superbe". This is actually realistic, in that French and Spanish capital ships could very well appear in varying colours.
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Do we actually want that? From a gameplay (NOT realism!) point of view, I'm inclined to say no.
But if yes, should the same trick also apply to other ship models?
 
It already does apply to some other ship models, e.g. "HMS_Bellona" and "RN_FirstRate". But not to "RN_Surprise", which is a bit of a surprise, as you'd expect frigates to change hands more often than big ships. I'll maybe see about allowing that one to switch sides. The movie-accurate "HMS_Surprise", on the other hand, is specific to Britain and should remain so!

What would be nice is if both the pale cream and dark yellow schemes were available together, rather than choosing one or the other at game installation. The darker yellow is probably the better one to make generally available - @Armada can probably confirm or deny this, but I'd guess that the pale colour found by the real HMS Victory team would only have been used by Britain, while the darker yellow might have been used by everyone.

So you need to look closely at flags! Or make sure you have a top grade compass, whose "radar" will tell you if that yellow ship is friend or foe. Or watch what company the ship is keeping - if it's near a red-painted ship and they're not firing at each other, it probably isn't British. ;)
 
Grey Roger said:
What would be nice is if both the pale cream and dark yellow schemes were available together, rather than choosing one or the other at game installation. The darker yellow is probably the better one to make generally available - @Armada can probably confirm or deny this, but I'd guess that the pale colour found by the real HMS Victory team would only have been used by Britain, while the darker yellow might have been used by everyone.
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Totally possible, of course. Won't make much of a difference for the modpack download size either, as both texture versions are already included.
It's quite a bit of work though to add all the extra variations, but if you're willing to do that, I don't see why not. :doff

Grey Roger said:
So you need to look closely at flags! Or make sure you have a top grade compass, whose "radar" will tell you if that yellow ship is friend or foe. Or watch what company the ship is keeping - if it's near a red-painted ship and they're not firing at each other, it probably isn't British. ;)
Click to expand...
Very true.
I was personally mainly thinking of Iron Man Mode, where you never have the luxury of a top grade compass with "radar".
So this will definitely add some extra difficulty to a game mode that is already quite difficult.
Whether this is desirable or not depends on the players though. I'm not a player, so I cannot really say what would be best....
 
Martes said:
When I import an obj into Maya, it works like a single, complicated object (no separation to details).
1. Is it all right, or I should make smaller parts and import them separately?
2. Can I, using this imported chunk, that contains, essentially, the whole ship, add locators and export it to GM, or there is some other magic I should do?
As on the screenshot, I do see my textures, so I very sincerely hope I don't have to do anything new with them.
Click to expand...
1. I've not tried exporting as a single object before; typically there is one mesh per texture.
I'm not sure how the exporter would interpret this, but you can try it. Try running through the basic locator setup and export in section 7 of the Editing and Exporting Models tutorial, and see how the model looks when you open it in GM Viewer.

2. You can add locators regardless of the mesh. Once we've got the export working properly with one locator, I'll explain which other ones you need to add.

Grey Roger said:
The darker yellow is probably the better one to make generally available - @Armada can probably confirm or deny this, but I'd guess that the pale colour found by the real HMS Victory team would only have been used by Britain, while the darker yellow might have been used by everyone.
Click to expand...
I don't think they found any evidence that other navies used the pale colour, so it could have been exclusive to Britain.
 
Wheee!

Well, some problems with normals on mirrored objects (best fixed in blender before export, I suspect), and one lost texture (the one I imported from COAS loong ago) - not bad for a start, I would say. This, of course, is purely experimental single-locator export attempt.

gm_view_1.png
 
Pieter Boelen said:
SUCCESFUL
Click to expand...

Let's not jump to conclusions, yet :)
Blender and Maya seem to have quite a disagreement over which normals face exactly where (I merged the hull halves in blender, and maya proudly inverted them both), and I am not yet sure how to solve this.
 
Let me put it this way: they're model files. They're in the GM Viewer.
I'd consider that at least the beginning of success. ;)
 
Nailed it!
Blender has a hidden option "Apply Object Transform", which shows the true normal directions, that can be fixed afterwards.
 
Oookay, it works :)))

(no screenshot, as visually you'll find no difference, and I still have to get the bottom coppering texture back)
But after all optimizations and such face count of the hull reduced to 103148. (I managed to turn "double sided" off :) )

Also, I found a way to export to multiple objects by material, but that makes the exporting to GM much longer, and the whole model a little bit more unmanageable, so one object coming from blender looks convenient and exports fast.

How do I attach the masts and gunpoints now?..
 
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Wow, I'm impressed that the export worked! Good catch on the double-sided setting, too; I thought 200k seemed like a lot for the hull by itself. :onya

To export the masts and yards as well is pretty straightforward. Import them into the same scene as the hull and place them in their correct positions. Then, create a locator for each part, name it in the usual convention (see below) and parent the parts to the locators. Now, parent the yard locators to their respective masts, and parent the mast locators to the hull. Your hierarchy should look something like this, with locators highlighted in blue:

  • Hull locator (name is not important)
    • Hull mesh(es)
    • Mast1
      • Mast1 meshes (bowsprit)
      • Rey_a1
        • yard mesh (spritsail)
    • Mast2
      • Mast2 meshes (foremast)
      • Rey_a2
        • yard mesh (course)
      • Rey_b2
        • yard mesh (topsail)
      • Rey_c2
        • yard mesh (topgallant sail)
    • Mast3
      • Mast3 meshes (mainmast)
      • (Same layout as mast1, but with Rey_a3, b3 and c3)
    • Mast4
      • Mast4 meshes (mizzen)
      • Rey_a4
        • yard mesh (spanker)
      • Rey_b4
        • yard mesh (mizzen top)
      • Rey_c4
        • yard mesh (mizzen topgallant)
Now, if you select all the locators and use Export Selection with the same settings, you should get one GM file per locator.
 
Ahha!

Thank you, @Armada, I will follow that.

Afterwards, would you tell me, how do I tie ropes and sails to all that? :)

P.S.

Should I separate the guns to a different gm, or it's OK like that?
 
Martes said:
Afterwards, would you tell me, how do I tie ropes and sails to all that? :)
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Yes. It's best to make sure the models export without any issues, first. ;)

Martes said:
Should I separate the guns to a different gm, or it's OK like that?
Click to expand...
You don't have to, but I'd recommend it to reduce the complexity of the hull GM.
 
:)
I am trying now to remount and export the masts and yards, and then I'll separate the guns.
 
@Armada, if you don't mind, additional question.
Should I wrap the mast and yards meshes in groups, or I can directly parent them to locators?

(my understanding is that I can, but I want to be sure :) )
 
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