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Fixed Pistol price discrepancy

MrMister

MrMister

Sailor Apprentice
Fine Flinstock Pistol: 33/99dmg, 10s, 51%, 723 or so gold.
Fine Duelist Pistol: 44/99dmg, 12s, 52%, 275 gold.


Why.
 
I tend to pay for my weapons with lead and steel rather than gold, so I've never noticed the prices. But I have often wondered why, if I press "2" to quick-equip a gun, it tends to prefer the flintlock pistol to the duelling pistol even if I have a higher quality duelling pistol in my inventory.

There is some degree of randomness involved in prices and accuracy. Base figures from "initItems.c" are:
"pistol2" (Duelling pistol): damage 40.0/60.0, accuracy 50, reload 12, price 208, rarity 0.50, minlevel 4
"PiratesPistol" (Flintlock): damage 30.0/60.0, accuracy 50, reload 10, price 554, rarity 0.20, minlevel 7

Perhaps reverse both the price and rarity, and bump up the accuracy of the duelling pistol a bit? To me, "duelling pistol" implies a higher quality weapon which in reality would be in a nice presentation case, whereas the flintlock pistol would be the common, mass-produced gun. Also drop the flintlock's minlevel to 4 - its stats are about the same as the duelling pistol's, so there's no need for it to require you to be higher level.
 
I dunno, the flinstock pistol looks like it should pack way more of a punch than the dueling pistol, which looks like a fancier version version of the short pistol. Furthermore, as a dueling gun elegance and accuracy would've been put above damage, since you don't need to kill your adversary instantly in a pistol duel - just shoot and hit him before he shoots, as to throw off his aim (and taking aim again AFTER being shot is terrible duel manners).

I say make Dueling more accurate than the flinstock, but give it less damage, and keep the longer reload. Something like this, with unmodified short pistol and doouble-barrel (essentially almost a double dueling pistol) for reference:
"pistol1" (Short pistol) : damage 15.0 /25.0, accuracy 5, reload 8 , price 150
"pistol2" (Duelling pistol): damage 35.0/40.0, accuracy 60, reload 12, price 228, rarity 0.50, minlevel 4
"PiratesPistol" (Flintlock): damage 30.0/60.0, accuracy 50, reload 10, price 554, rarity 0.20, minlevel 7
"Pistol6"(Double-barrel) : damage 30.0/40.0, accuracy 55, reload 20, price 1026, rarity 0.05, minlevel 9
 
The only reason you wouldn't need to kill your opponent in a duel is if it was a less serious affair and both sides had agreed to "first blood" rather than "to the death". If it's "to the death" and you only fired quickly to throw off his aim then he's perfectly entitled to fire back, and he still has a loaded pistol while you've just wasted your shot.

But I agree about the elegance and accuracy, which is why I'd give the duelling pistol a bit more accuracy and make it the more expensive of the two.

If you want more hitting power, wait until you've levelled up enough, then you get the horse pistol.
 
Grey Roger said:
But I have often wondered why, if I press "2" to quick-equip a gun, it tends to prefer the flintlock pistol to the duelling pistol even if I have a higher quality duelling pistol in my inventory.
Click to expand...
Can that be explained through the 'minlevel' between both guns?
 
Grey Roger said:
But I have often wondered why, if I press "2" to quick-equip a gun, it tends to prefer the flintlock pistol to the duelling pistol even if I have a higher quality duelling pistol in my inventory.
Click to expand...
Can that be explained through the 'minlevel' between both guns?
 
Or the price.

Tangentially related, how does the "accuracy" stat work exactly? I assume it actually scales with distance and a hit check isn't just a RNG against the value shown in the item stat?
 
I'm not sure, truth be told.
The answer is probably somewhere in the Loc_ai folder.
 
Looking into this a bit further:

"pistol2" is the long pistol from the stock game, barely changed apart from the description and max damage has risen from 55.0 to 60.0. Perhaps put it back to being the long pistol, description "A common pistol with a long barrel. Decent range and punch, but it reloads slowly and is not too accurate." (Maybe leave out the bit about accuracy, as 50.0 isn't bad for a pistol.) The flintlock pistol will then have higher max damage (60.0 as at present).

"pistol5" is currently the horse pistol, formerly the scrapper pistol in the stock game. The original had damage 60.0/80.0 and minlevel 7, while the current version has damage 50.0/150.0 and minlevel 16. So another possibility would be to raise the flintlock's damage to match the old scrapper pistol values - it already has the same minlevel.
 
So, does anyone have any preferences on this?
  1. Reverse price and rarity between flintlock and duelling pistol, increase duelling pistol's accuracy, reduce flintlock's minlevel?
  2. Revert duelling pistol to stock long pistol, along with stock description, and give flintlock pistol the damage values of the stock scrapper pistol?
  3. Leave them as they are?
I'm inclined towards 2 - put the duelling pistol back to being the stock long pistol and make the flintlock into the stock scrapper pistol.

Maybe try to find another pistol model to use for a proper duelling pistol - very rare, very expensive and very accurate. And for preference, ornate.
 
@Grey Roger, I agree with the choice number 2.
The double barrel pistol should be higher than both though. This was always a special gun in the original game - You could steal one from the office next to the Spanish governors residence on Isla Muelle and was a bit of an Easter egg in the original game. In the current game they become plentiful once you start getting up the levels and they have fairly poor performance. Also, the 4 barrel pistol performance is now so poor that you would not bother with it at all (it was the best in the original game) by the time you have the advanced gunman perk needed and the level at which they appear. I would go for the brace of 4 pistols from Clint Eastwood in preference every time.

Hope this helps.
 
Good points, @salonikasurf!

Looking at the stats from the stock game, the dual barrel pistol had damage of 45.0 / 55.0, compared to 30.0/40.0 now. But, as you say, it was a special item, gained by burgling the house next door to Isla Muelle (now San Juan) residence. I'm inclined to create a new dual barrel pistol based on one I found in the GoF mod for CoAS, give that the stats for the original version, and make it only available in the same residence.

The quad-barrel pistol only had damage of 35.0 / 45.0 in the stock game - the scrapper pistol was much better and even the long pistol did more damage per shot. The quad-barrel pistol's damage was about the same as the basic short pistol (30.0 / 45.0). By comparison, both guns are downgraded in Build 14 - the short pistol is only 15.0 / 25.0, so the quad-barrel hasn't done so badly to go down to 20.0 / 30.0. The brace of 4 pistols from Clint Eastwood would still be far superior even if I put both the short pistol and quad pistol back to their stock values, and quite rightly too, partly because you get them from Clint Eastwood and partly because they're horse pistols - "the most powerful handgun in the world". :guns:
 
Here's what I'm planning to use for a duelling pistol. Based on something I found in CoAS:GoF, it has an interesting looking base on the grip.
duelling_pistol.jpg duelling_pistol2.jpg
Damage to be 75.0 / 100.0, i.e. a tighter bracket in the middle of the horse pistol's damage range, the tighter bracket reflecting the gun's accuracy. Accuracy rating is a bit higher than the horse pistol, price is a lot higher, minlevel is the same, and rarity is a lot lower - 0.01. So it shouldn't end up being dominant at high levels the way some supposedly rare swords are, but you might find one occasionally. (Possibly use it in quests, too.)

And here's what might end up next door to the governor of San Juan. Another one from CoAS:GoF, and again the base of the grip is interesting.
double_barrel.jpg double_barrel2.jpg
Damage is 45.0/55.0, the same as the stock game's double barrel pistol, and it's unique, minlevel 99, rarity 0.0, which means there's only one in the game and it's the one in that house.
 
If the 4 barrel pistol is so poor - maybe we should reduce the level that it is available - a lot earlier in the game and not have it requireing professional gunman ability. It should be similar to the brace of three small pistols just a little better.

I find the small pistol pretty irrelevant in the game now as its damage is equivalent to one or two hits with a good saber or cutlass even at the start of the game.
 
The quad-barrel pistol is better than the brace of three small pistols. They have the same damage as a single small pistol, except you get three shots. The quad-barrel pistol does a bit more damage per shot and you get four shots. As for removing the requirement for "professional gunman", if I read the code correctly, that can't be done, or at least, not specifically for the quad-barrel pistol. The requirement for "gunman" or "professional gunman" is set by number of shots, not by specific gun type - all guns with 2 shots require "gunman", all guns with 4 shots require "professional gunman".

The small pistol does indeed have about the same damage as the lower level swords, which is reasonable. The advantage is that you get to do that damage before you close for fencing. At the start of the game, that's significant. Later on, you'll have more HP, so will most enemies, and you'll probably also have acquired a better sword and a better gun.
 
Yeah, I'm all for downgrading pistol2 to just a "long pistol" and making the flintock better. Might also allow for changing those professions that currently start with a horse pistol to start with a flintock instead, as personally I find the horse pistol a bit overpowered to have for much of the earlygame.

I like your ide for a new dueiling pistol - I don't know how leveld lists work in this game, but maybe make it likely to be carried by captains of military ships.

I never knew about a unique gun being just in a random house, specially since I haven't been looting random houses since The Witcher 2, where the easyness and tolerance with which you can do so became immersion-breaking. Is there any in-game indication of that house having something special, like a town rumor?
 
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